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 Post subject: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 7:16 am 
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Joined: Mon May 06, 2019 11:25 pm
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Hi all,

So I saw this video by Gary Reed:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vINRgiOxrV4

Can anyone explain this behavior; why does it stay in series, shouldn't parallel be more efficient at 90-100km/h+? And why does it switch to parallel later when SOC is (a bit) lower?

He does not give us exact speeds, what I can tell from the video he's mostly doing 90-110km/h. So very "high" highway speeds but still.. 6.2 or 6.4 L/100km both sound impressive.

[Save mode] + [~50% SOC or more] on highway = Series mode = Win?

Seems strange to me considering that the battery never really is 'empty' and that parallel should be more efficient (if I'm wrong, why does parallel exist?).

My 2019 is arriving in a couple of days, can't wait :D

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:03 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
Posts: 3960
Location: Netherlands
As he says, the car is intelligent; it will choose the most efficient mode for the power demand (which governs, rather than the speed).
The function of the buttons is to tell the car at what level you wish to keep your battery:
1.You have pressed neither - it may be drained to minimum - the car will go into the save cycle at the lowest point
2. You have pressed "save - the car will attempt to keep the battery at that level.
3. You have pressed "charge" - the car will attempt to keep the battery as full as possible.
The choice of the mode is determined by the use you envisage: If you need some battery power off the highway at the end of the trip you can use "save" at the appropriate level.
If you need a full battery at the end of the motorway ( mountains ahead, or an environmental zone) you use charge.
If you are just pottering around use neither.
I tend to run the car at "charge" on the motorway, but my speeds are often 130 kph+.
Series or parallel mode is determined by the power demand (AKA your right foot ;) )
Below something like 50 kph parallel cannot engage as the wheels are turning too slowly.
In general there is no need to play the car like a piano with buttons and paddles, all gains you might make are marginal, if any.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 11:12 pm 
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jaapv wrote:
As he says [...]


So it'll always be power demand, not speed which govern series/parallel. This seems logical but does not explain why it did choose series with more battery left and then switched to parallel.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 11:20 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
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Location: Netherlands
Power demand (mainly), road speed, battery charge level, button settings, the car juggles the parameters. Without knowing the exact circumstances and the algorithms it is not easy to answer the question. If you search the forum you will find interesting graphs that go a long way to explaining the system.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 2:04 am 
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jaapv wrote:
Power demand (mainly), road speed, battery charge level, button settings, the car juggles the parameters. Without knowing the exact circumstances and the algorithms it is not easy to answer the question. If you search the forum you will find interesting graphs that go a long way to explaining the system.


Well I have done plenty of searching and reading here, It's a great forum full with expertise :D I'm familiar with the concepts of EV/CHARGE/SAVE-functions, and EV/SERIES/PARALLEL-modes.

I was mostly amazed by the low consumption he achieved, from my own experience (test-driving before I decided on one) and what I've read, highway consumption is usually about 7-7.5L/100km. That'd be 10-15% lower figures from simply having higher SOC and using SAVE. I'll be doing some testing on my own for sure...

Then I got a bit intrigued by the switch from series to parallel with the same parameters other than the lower SOC. I guess we will never know exactly how the car de determinate EV/SERIES/PARALLEL... unless someone here would go work for Mitsubishi 'undercover' :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 4:09 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:47 am
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Location: Southern end of North Yorkshire, UK
It's worth noting from some of Gary's other videos that he acknowledges he gets better fuel economy than many others because he lives in rural Canada and rarely drives over 50mph/80kmph or has to accelerate quickly at junctions etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 4:20 am 
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richr wrote:
It's worth noting from some of Gary's other videos that he acknowledges he gets better fuel economy than many others because he lives in rural Canada and rarely drives over 50mph/80kmph or has to accelerate quickly at junctions etc.


Thanks, that's a valid point.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 9:07 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:33 pm
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Location: British Columbia, Canada
I think (note: think, not know) that speed is very important in this equation. Faster you go, lower the mpg (in my case, higher l/100km).

We went on a drive yesterday from Creston BC to Sandpoint ID. About 200 km back and froth. Used a full tank of electricity and less than 1/2 tank of gasoline. The PHEV reported 6l/100km. But, the max we drove was around 110 km, little passing, lots of up/down but nothing serious in climbing. I'm sure that if the road had been straight and flat and empty we'd have been around (or below) 5l/100km. Which is pretty amazing for a car of this size and weight. No complaints here.


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 5:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 09, 2019 4:07 pm
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Location: Laval, Québec, Canada
Hi,

I just join this forum, but am also on a Europeen forum on which I discover that the NA algorithms are different from the EU. In Europe, the SAVE button alternate between parallel and EV. Mine alternate between series and EV. This when over 70km/hr and no high power demand, generally flat RoadSoft, no big hills.

I have personnally experienced much better performance in parallel mode above 70km/hr. On the same 170km trip, using normal SAVE mode I get around 6l/100km. When manaully alternating between CHARGE and EV, I get around 5l/100km. Big difference.

Why this difference between NA and EU version? My guess is EU CO2 emissions are more strict and battery waranty 6 years for EU vs 8 for NA. So less battery stress and more fuel consumption enable Mitsubishi to offer better waranty which they cannot do in EU.

Any comments?

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode / Series on highway [Gary Reed video]
PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2019 12:58 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
Posts: 3960
Location: Netherlands
mellobob wrote:
I think (note: think, not know) that speed is very important in this equation. Faster you go, lower the mpg (in my case, higher l/100km).

We went on a drive yesterday from Creston BC to Sandpoint ID. About 200 km back and froth. Used a full tank of electricity and less than 1/2 tank of gasoline. The PHEV reported 6l/100km. But, the max we drove was around 110 km, little passing, lots of up/down but nothing serious in climbing. I'm sure that if the road had been straight and flat and empty we'd have been around (or below) 5l/100km. Which is pretty amazing for a car of this size and weight. No complaints here.
I find that even imperceptible climbing can make a significant difference. When I drive from my home to the south of Germany which is a 900 km motorway drive with a 800 m altitude difference I find the car runs about 10.5 km/l on the way down and 11.5 km/l back. I've made this run more that ten times and there is always the same effect.

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