calling on 2019 owners

I guess Mitsubishi is more interested in the long-term conservation of the battery than in short-term fluctuations. Remember that they give an eight-year guaranty and thus expect the car to perform satisfactory for over ten years or more.
I would not be surprised if this has to do with reducing the charging strain.

jaapv said:

I guess Mitsubishi is more interested in the long-term conservation of the battery than in short-term fluctuations. Remember that they give an eight-year guaranty and thus expect the car to perform satisfactory for over ten years or more.
I would not be surprised if this has to do with reducing the charging strain.

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Yeah.. at this rate that will be super easy:

Dear costumer, take this beautiful PHEV and enjoy the whole 52km of elétrica range for a month or so. You’ll be amazed by the sole decreasing range after. And when you feel it’s lackluster I’ll just put it under the machine to tell you it’s just fine and you’re just have to do normal driving for a change. If you insist I’ll do some triple something to the traction system. That I’ll solve the problem for a couple of months! This will be made whenever you need until you get tired of it or until warranty wares of.
Enjoy the ride!

Sorry for the sarcasm :mrgreen:

I find the idea of the OP getting so irate about a car he doesn't have rather odd. :shock:

greendwarf said:

I find the idea of the OP getting so irate about a car he doesn't have rather odd. :shock:

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You're right. I'm surely exaggerating. I'm sure there must be (very) happy owners around here, and I might be telling bad thing about their rides Sorry!

In the end i think that's because I really think this concept is the way to go for my (and much more people's) daily routine. And it would be a right bet if I didn't feel it might be "abusing" the trust consumers deposing on Mitsu's brand image...

To all of you lucky proud owners, please share your experience.

luispcorreia said:

jaapv said:

I guess Mitsubishi is more interested in the long-term conservation of the battery than in short-term fluctuations. Remember that they give an eight-year guaranty and thus expect the car to perform satisfactory for over ten years or more.
I would not be surprised if this has to do with reducing the charging strain.

Click to expand...

Yeah.. at this rate that will be super easy:

Dear costumer, take this beautiful PHEV and enjoy the whole 52km of elétrica range for a month or so. You’ll be amazed by the sole decreasing range after. And when you feel it’s lackluster I’ll just put it under the machine to tell you it’s just fine and you’re just have to do normal driving for a change. If you insist I’ll do some triple something to the traction system. That I’ll solve the problem for a couple of months! This will be made whenever you need until you get tired of it or until warranty wares of.
Enjoy the ride!

Sorry for the sarcasm :mrgreen:

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Yeah. Well, having driven the car for over five years and 130.000 km with still fully acceptable EV performance, I think these three-month rants are less than useful. Rather typical for the Internet, I might add.
I might point out that in -for instance- my country where the PHEV was the best-selling car overall for a year and there are tens of thousands on the road, this is an absolute non-issue.

If what is happening is by design and perfectly Ok why don't Mitsubishi provide a detailed explanation that satisfies all of it's critics.
Also why is it necessary when they already don't allow a full charge or discharge to protect the battery from degradation. I have read elsewhere that such provisions would prevent degradation for an indeterminate period of time certainly the life of the vehicle.
Apparently the chip on the BMU cannot be reprogrammed so if Mitsubishi want to resolve this issue they would have to replace the chip by either changing the whole unit or removing and replacing the chip, either way it would be expensive.
For those owners who don't think there is a problem they're either extremely lucky or failing to face up to the truth, there is a third alternative but hopefully Mitsubishi would not sink so low.
Come clean Mitsubishi tell us the truth.

Scroll down here a bit for a graphic from Watchdog. Note: the cars that fall far below the average have mostly been abused by CHAdeMO chargers, the cars far above have mostly been driven without charging. The average as is shown here is exactly what one could expect. I cannot believe that Mitsubishi shipped a special fast-degrading PHEV model to the USA only... :roll:

https://phevblog.nl/2019/01/05/accu-conditie/

Note that this applies to the first model battery. The nominal capacity was 40 AH, the normal drop within the first 10.000 km was to 35 Ah on average, after which it will decline on a gradual slope down to 25 Ah @ 300.000 km. Depending, of course, on the way the owner will use the car.
I don't see a problem, just a lack of understanding of the way battery-driven vehicles work.
BTW, the BMU can certainly be reprogrammed - by Mitsubishi and when needed.
Full capacity for an indeterminate time? Please give me the address of your Unicorn dealer.

All I can say, having read all these responses, is the following.

I live in an area where there are very few electric cars, but many people who are thinking about it. Seeing my Outlander PHEV they often ask me - what do you think?

I tell them the facts based on my experience.

- I've owned this vehicle for nine months
- I've driven 3,700km
- Its been driven moderately and the heater and air conditioning haven't been used yet
- The maximum EV cruising distance, which I monitor regularly by noting the trip distance when the battery runs out, has reduced by 22%, from 54km to 42km and appears to be reducing gradually, week by week

They look at me and shake their heads. I know what they're thinking. "If this is the reality of electric cars, I think I'll give it a miss for the time being. Especially as they're so expensive"

Mitsubishi, by their total denial of this issue, have lost the plot. And they are also doing considerable harm to the undoubted global benefit there would be for more buy-in for people to be using electric vehicles.

Which runs counter to the experience of tens of thousands of users who have been running these cars up to over five years and many millions of kms in total. So?

So?

Mitsubishi should be concerned that one of their newer vehicles is performing poorly and offer to do something about it.

Instead, they just tell me this is quite normal.

SimonR73 said:

So?

Mitsubishi should be concerned that one of their newer vehicles is performing poorly and offer to do something about it.

Instead, they just tell me this is quite normal.

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Thanks for your input.

That’s exactly the thing I don’t want to go through.

And if the only way to deal with that decrease on the newer models is to have a really good relationship with the dealer or perform 1 whole day operations on the car by myself.. well thanks but no thanks

So don't buy one then. Unlike 6 years ago, there are now several PHEV SUVs on the market to choose from if you're buying new. I'm sure they all have their issues and things that don't suit everyone.

You did the right thing for doing your research before spending a lot of money. I did the same, plus a lot of research on the forums for the Audi A3 e-tron and BMW 225xi which were options in my price range. And I found things I didn't like about the A3 on the Audi forums that some members were getting angry and upset about and others were saying it wasn't really an issue if you understood what was going on. I actually decided the specific issue (not actually an EV related one) probably wouldn't be a problem for how I intended to use the car, but ruled it out simply based on the boot not being big enough. I ruled out the BMW based on other factors before I got into too many specifics.

Ultimately if you push any battery hard it'll degrade faster. So on a PHEV of any make, lots of rapid charging, lots of high load driving with it forced into EV mode (when the car would prefer to use the engine) and lots fully discharging and recharging will all affect the capacity. It's no different to a petrol car - accelerate to the red line all the time, turn if off when it's very hot, drive it hard when it's cold etc will all mean the engine sufferes. Look after a BEV or PHEV and it'll last and perform well, just like looking after a petrol or diesel engine. Whether Mitsubishi could make it perform better isn't that relevant as far as I'm concerned, it is what it is and if you don't like it, don't buy it.

I came to the conclusion that the battery degradation on 2013-2016 models was nothing to worry about so bought a second hand pre-facelift 2015 model for about twice what I'd normally spend on a car (offset by not having to pay car tax and the saving in fuel). It's just approaching 60,000 miles and the estimated range after a change is always around 24 miles, which drops to about 22 once I've driven about 500 metres. I can still do a week of commuting to the railway station without using any petrol. That to me means the car is doing what I bought it for. I don't obsess about it losing 0.1Ah of capacity, because I don't find it useful to do that sort of thing. I want the car to get me to work cheaply and cleanly, and be able to drive to the other end of the country at weekends if I want to. It does that and I don't expect that to change in the five years or so I intend to own it.

I find that the football team I support tells everyone that they can win games. In reality that's proved not to be the case this year. Don't always assume that anyone selling something will tell you anything other than what you want to hear. Do your independent research and draw your own conclusions. If you find something you don't like, rule it out and look at another possibility. (To be honest, Chesterfield Football Club have been pretty rubbish for a while).

How could they be so high? The nominal capacity is 40Ah, normal delivery 37.5 Ah. Stick with the regular battery condition reports from the dealer instead of all kinds of amateur gizmos. The battery condition is measured at each service and checked against the official degradation curve.

That doesn't appear in the service schedules and you are not provided with a copy at a service so I would be interested how you know this is part of their procedure.
Also my MY18 is "degrading" on regular basis but I have never had a Chademo or any ot to the best of my knowledge it has not been abused that way although it was run by Mitsubishi for the first 6 months of it's life but surely they would not abuse a vehicle that way with all their knowledge of its consequences.

As all dealers do so. They will provide the report at request, sometimes for a small charge. I don’t know about the USA but would be surprised if it were different.

I've yet to find a dealer in the London area who can do it :roll:

Weird... :roll: I cannot think of any dealer here who cannot. Maybe it has to do with Brexit... :mrgreen:

I have asked for this at almost every service over the last 3 years / 105,000 miles at 4 different dealerships. None can do it, nor will they even think about it.

I get one on request every service

My brand new 2019 bought in Aug with just under 5000kms on it has degraded to 34.7 AH.