ICE Mileage?

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stevorh

Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Messages
8
Hi,

Quick question, is there a way to tell how many miles are on your ICE? I use EV mostly to and from work and rarely use the ICE, how do I know when to change the oil? Thanks.
 
stevorh said:
Hi,

Quick question, is there a way to tell how many miles are on your ICE? I use EV mostly to and from work and rarely use the ICE, how do I know when to change the oil? Thanks.

The Outlander's maintenance schedule is based on vehicle mileage, not engine mileage. In the US, oil changes are due every 7500 miles or 6 months, even if the engine hardly ever runs. I think that's overkill, especially since synthetic oil is required, but that's what Mitsubishi requires to maintain the warranty.
 
jaapv said:
Over here the scheduled oil change is once every 20.000 km or once a year. I think even that is overkill.

Agreed. It's annoying that Mitsu didn't come up with a more realistic maintenance schedule for the PHEV. At 6 months, I'll have to drain synthetic oil that will be almost brand new. And synthetic oil changes aren't cheap.
 
Okay, that's what I thought. That's frustrating! At the very least I wish there was a way to track how much your ICE has been used.
 
stevorh said:
Hi,

Quick question, is there a way to tell how many miles are on your ICE? I use EV mostly to and from work and rarely use the ICE, how do I know when to change the oil? Thanks.

Hi, in EU - once per year is standard.
As they say, no matter how much the ICE has run, one year is more or less the "best before date" for an engine oil that's installed in an engine. Contaminations picked up by the oil (petrol, etc), or resulted by the heat are the primary factors behind this consideration. In my service document I have 20,000 km service intervals set up.
Of course, if you rarely use the ICE - like myself too - you'll never pass 20,000 kms in a year, at least, not with the ICE.
 
mrqz said:
Hi, in EU - once per year is standard.

I'd be fine with a year, as that was the oil change interval for the Cherokee I traded in for the Mitsu (which didn't even use synthetic oil). But having to take a step backwards and change the oil every 6 months is going to get old. At least the first one is free.
 
I also wish there was a battery level percentage meter somewhere. As best I can tell it only gives your a visual level and a range, is that correct?
 
stevorh said:
I also wish there was a battery level percentage meter somewhere. As best I can tell it only gives your a visual level and a range, is that correct?

Correct, though the battery is divided into 16 level blocks on the power flow screen, so those should equate to 6.25% per block. I agree that a numeric percentage meter would be much better.
 
generaltso said:
stevorh said:
Hi,

Quick question, is there a way to tell how many miles are on your ICE? I use EV mostly to and from work and rarely use the ICE, how do I know when to change the oil? Thanks.

The Outlander's maintenance schedule is based on vehicle mileage, not engine mileage. In the US, oil changes are due every 7500 miles or 6 months, even if the engine hardly ever runs. I think that's overkill, especially since synthetic oil is required, but that's what Mitsubishi requires to maintain the warranty.

I don't think synthetic oil is specified, at least not here in Australia.
 
HHL said:
I don't think synthetic oil is specified, at least not here in Australia.

They don't use the word synthetic, but the required oil weight is 0W20, which only comes in synthetic (at least here in the US).
 
generaltso said:
HHL said:
I don't think synthetic oil is specified, at least not here in Australia.

They don't use the word synthetic, but the required oil weight is 0W20, which only comes in synthetic (at least here in the US).

Ok... it gets a bit cold where you are.. the spec here is 10W30, even 20W40 is allowed, although I would go for the freer flowing oil, but there is no specific requirement to use fully synth oil.
 
HHL said:
Ok... it gets a bit cold where you are.. the spec here is 10W30, even 20W40 is allowed, although I would go for the freer flowing oil, but there is no specific requirement to use fully synth oil.

Sounds like you’ve definitely got more options. Here it’s only 0W20 that’s allowed, which means synthetic only.
 
Apparently in Canada, because of our "severe operating environment" & 10 year warranty, Mitsubishi Canada wants us to change oil...every 3 months. GAH!!!

Hearing that 0W-20 is synthetic as well sounds like a MASSIVE waste of resources & money. I don't even think the gas engine runs enough even if you don't charge the car to make that 3 months justifiable.
 
Trades46 said:
Apparently in Canada, because of our "severe operating environment" & 10 year warranty, Mitsubishi Canada wants us to change oil...every 3 months. GAH!!!

Hearing that 0W-20 is synthetic as well sounds like a MASSIVE waste of resources & money. I don't even think the gas engine runs enough even if you don't charge the car to make that 3 months justifiable.

Technically, the northern USA probably falls under the "sever operating environment" also since it gets cold and we use salt on the roads. But there's no way I'm getting a $90 oil change every 3 months for an engine that probably will have less than 5 hours of run time.
 
The US cars have an oil change monitor that can be changed between the 6 month and 1 year change interval.

Using synthetic oil doesn't give a longer drain interval as it's the additive package that does most of the work, not the base oil.

Oil change intervals are set on miles, or operating hours, or calendar time, whichever comes first. Unless one is using oil analysis to confirm the ability of the oil to keep functioning, it's best to stick with the maintenance interval (normal or severe) based on the schedules.
 
AndyH said:
The US cars have an oil change monitor that can be changed between the 6 month and 1 year change interval.

Are you sure it can be changed to 1 year? The owners manual says that the interval can be changed for extreme conditions, but that would reduce it to 3 months.
 
generaltso said:
AndyH said:
The US cars have an oil change monitor that can be changed between the 6 month and 1 year change interval.

Are you sure it can be changed to 1 year? The owners manual says that the interval can be changed for extreme conditions, but that would reduce it to 3 months.
The US intervals are 1 year/15,000 miles for normal, or 6 months/7500 miles for severe.

View attachment oci.jpg
 
AndyH said:
The US cars have an oil change monitor that can be changed between the 6 month and 1 year change interval.

Not according to the Mitsubishi Maintenance Manual (or my PHEV).

https://mcarsstatic.cachefly.net/pdf/owners/owners-manuals/2018MY%20PHEV%20Waranty%20Manual%20Maintenance.pdf

Did yours come with the maintenenance reminder set to 1 year or did you change it to that? Here’s mine.
 

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generaltso said:
AndyH said:
The US cars have an oil change monitor that can be changed between the 6 month and 1 year change interval.

Not according to the Mitsubishi Maintenance Manual (or my PHEV).

https://mcarsstatic.cachefly.net/pdf/owners/owners-manuals/2018MY%20PHEV%20Waranty%20Manual%20Maintenance.pdf

Did yours come with the maintenenance reminder set to 1 year or did you change it to that? Here’s mine.
I changed it to 1 year.** The only options it gives is 1 year or 6 months. It can be flipped when it's reset.

I agree with you about the maintenance schedule as printed - it does say 6 months or 3 months. The dash monitor, however, displays different intervals.

If you're ok with a diversion, I'll share what I suspect is the back-story for the difference between the computer and the book. (Jump to the splats...er..asterisks to skip the oil stuff.)

- Engine oil is a mix of about 70-80% base oil and 20-30% additives
-- The base oil can be derived from petroleum (group I, II, III) or can be man-made (group IV, V)
-- The additives are in a carrier oil that can be from any of the 5 groups
-- The additive package has the heat-activated anti-wear chemistry, antioxidants, rust preventatives, acid neutralizers, etc.
- In the US, as a result of a ruling by the National Advertising division of the Better Business Bureau, it's 'legal' (in the US) to call an oil with a group III base (made from hydrocracked petroleum) 'synthetic'. This is not legal in the rest of the world. (Sorry Canada and Mexico - I don't recall if the NAD ruling covers all of NA or just the US.)

So here's our first problem: Synthetic oil in Japan and Europe is man-made. Synthetic oil in the US might or (most often) might not be.

The second problem is one of service life. The base oil is important, but the additive package in the oil does most of the work. Oil specifications are performance-based, not recipe-based. Equipment manufacturers define a performance limit (0.00x mm camshaft wear in 100 hours or something similar) and oil chemists try to come up with a formula that protects that engine that much (and no more, 'cause beancounters). The different service requirements spawned a bunch of OEM-specific specifications. Some engines are protected well enough with a more generic 'one size fits most' specification, while others require more specific service ratings.

Last piece... There are a number of oil standards bodies. JASO (Japan), API (US), ACEA (Europe) are the biggies. JASO quality specs are what the Mitsubishi engineers had in mind when they designed the engine and set the service intervals. Because the cars were being shipped to other areas of the world where consumers couldn't find JASO-spec oil at the local parts store (and because Japanese manufacturers were also having problems with our inferior oil), ILSAC was born. ILSAC is an effort to 'harmonize' standards between JASO and the API.

Here's an example of why that matters to us and to Mitsubishi:

Europe's been using 1 and 2 year drain intervals for many years. To do that, they use real synthetic oil with an additive package made for long service life. Euro cars' oil life systems are calibrated against this high-quality oil. When these vehicles were imported to the US, Benz started having bizarre engine failures that they didn't see in Europe. Engines were failing because instead of being serviced with a man-made synthetic, engines were filled with common petroleum-based products designed for a 3000-5000 mile service life.

https://www.stle.org/images/pdf/STL...ng Synthetic Lubricants_tlt article_Jan10.pdf
https://www.autosafety.org/cas-oil-sludge-letter-2-chrysler-ceo-zetsche/

Mitsubishi recommends that we look for an ILSAC quality label first (ILSAC GF-5). If we can't find that, look for an API-SN oil.
https://www.oilspecifications.org/ilsac.php

0W-20 synthetic is recommended. An ILSAC-rated 5W-20 can be used. (Owner's manual 9-7)

They make these minimum-standard recommendations because they're confident enough that US oils that carry GF-5/SN will work well enough so most engines in the field will survive to the end of the warranty period. They don't like warranty extensions, class actions, or the optics of engines failing for any reason. ILSAC GF-5 and API-SN oils are made for 6 month/7500 mile change intervals, regardless if petroleum or synthetic. That's how our 6 month/3 month intervals are set for normal/severe service.

We can buy Japanese synthetic oils (like this Idemitsu 0W-20) for about $5/qt (if it's made in Japan it'll be synthetic, but if made in the US Idemitsu plant, it'll likely be Group III), or a synthetic made by a Euro company. We have to use the 3 month/6 month service intervals. We can buy a Euro synthetic oil that meets ILSAC GF-5 and change it at 3 or 6 month intervals.
We can buy a US 'synthetic' oil that meets ILSAC GF-5...3/6 intervals.

If we want to use an oil blended in the US and also want it to be 'real' synthetic, the field narrows to two. In the US, the only two companies that blend man-made synthetic oil are Redline and AMSOIL. Redline products are built to run for OEM change intervals (they make some tough race oils, but those are changed very frequently). AMSOIL makes long-life products that'll run to 25,000 and 35,000 miles of severe service (or a year, whichever comes first).

**Finally...back to my 1 year interval selection...
I'm running AMSOIL 0W-20. I'll start oil analysis at the 6 month mark so I have documentation of oil serviceability to meet warranty requirements. I expect to be able to run at least 1 year oil change intervals, and probably longer. I'll still have to change filters every six months, though. I'll perform the other inspections using the severe service "Schedule 1" as most of my driving will be in short trips in a hot city environment.

(The full disclosure part...I had a small business working with small fleet operators for just over 12 years. I was an AMSOIL commercial jobber and studied tribology. The nature of the business was 1/3 sales and 2/3 'reliability nerd'. That business no longer exists and I don't sell anything.)
 
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