Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Forum

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 Post subject: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:19 am 
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I'm going to check one out at a dealer in the States on Saturday. I'm trying to figure a suitable replacement for our Subaru Outback. And let me tell you, there's lot of people out there that LOVE their Subarus, and I can largely see why. We could end up getting another one, but this vehicle looks pretty neat. One thing I can't tell from the forum though, is, does this vehicle inspire fans? Because I think that's a good sign for a car.

Brian


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:10 pm 
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Location: New York, USA
blweeden wrote:
I'm going to check one out at a dealer in the States on Saturday. I'm trying to figure a suitable replacement for our Subaru Outback. And let me tell you, there's lot of people out there that LOVE their Subarus, and I can largely see why. We could end up getting another one, but this vehicle looks pretty neat. One thing I can't tell from the forum though, is, does this vehicle inspire fans? Because I think that's a good sign for a car.

Brian


Hello Brian, to find how much people like a particular brand or model, usually the best gauge is repeat purchases aka purchase loyalty. This can be seen in various surveys, such as in the USA by Edmund's, which puts Mitsubishi near the bottom: https://www.edmunds.com/about/press/toy ... veals.html. Consumer Reports also has an "Owner Satisfaction" index (separate from Reliability), and Mitsubishi... is near the bottom again: https://www.consumerreports.org/car-rel ... tisfaction

On the bright side... well, there is no way to sugar coat this. Feel better about Mitsubishi? :lol:

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Possible future owner of 2020 Outlander PHEV SEL (USA)


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:20 pm 
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Well that's interesting. And concerning!

I wonder what the reason for that is. It seems that the reliability of Mitsu products has been OK from some data I've seen, so ... curious.

I see you're a potential future owner, so maybe it hasn't warded you off entirely yet :).

Brian


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:00 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
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Location: Netherlands
The reason is simple - At introduction these cars were heavily subsidized in many markets - As governments have a habit of winding down subsidies, the car got effectively considerably more expensive over time - and plug-in hybrids are expensive in the first place, That is highly damaging to customer loyalty.
As for liking - I came from Jaguar to this car. Nothing could induce me to return to that brand. I'm driving this one until it falls apart. Judging by the way it keeps going until now it is likely that I will fall to pieces first. I'll probably will have to have the battery replaced at some point. I've figured out that that is adding an estimated 3 cents per km. Peanuts compared to the money it has been saving -and still is.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 7:37 pm 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
Hey Brian, I traded in a 2012 Subaru Outback when I got my PHEV, so I can comment directly. My Subaru had 170km on it, so still had some life, but I was attracted by the rebates (unfortunately no longer offered here in Ontario), the technology and my desire to generate less carbon. Overall, the Outlander is very similar to the Outback from a space and features point of view. It tows a bit less, but I'm okay with that.

In my experience, Subaru's overall quality is a little higher than Mitsubishi's. However the Mits quality has improved a lot from when I drove an earlier model Outlander in 2011.

I did love the Subaru in snow, the suspension and CVT were very smooth, and it was quiet on the highway. I haven't driven the Outlander much in snow yet, but I hear it is pretty good. The engine in the Outlander is almost impossible to hear unless you floor it, so it is quiet as well. Very quiet on electric of course.

I find fuel economy in "Save" mode (where the ICE runs to maintain battery level) is around 6.0 to 8.0 litres/100km. The Outback was in the 7.0 to 9.0 range. The benefit is if you are able to drive electric a lot, the Outlander can do much better. I drive electric most of the week, with occasional longer trips, and it has been averaging 4.8 l/100km overall.

Bottom line, if Subaru offered a PHEV it would have been my first choice. However, the Outlander is basically the only choice in this segment and it is also very good. It has been refined over a number of years, and there is a lot of information available if you have issues.

FWIW,
Mike.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 7:50 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 2:50 pm
Posts: 156
Location: New York, USA
blweeden wrote:
Well that's interesting. And concerning!

I wonder what the reason for that is. It seems that the reliability of Mitsu products has been OK from some data I've seen, so ... curious.

I see you're a potential future owner, so maybe it hasn't warded you off entirely yet :).

Brian


3 words: Federal Tax Credit :) I'm actually more of a Toyota guy (if there was a plug-in RAV4 for 2-3 thousand more, I would get it). Whenever US gets the 13.8 kWh battery, that credit rises to $6,711, plus another $1,500 state (California), meaning at least an $8,000 difference to anything else that doesn't qualify. Also, as you mentioned, the reliability of the Outlander has been relatively good.

msmatt wrote:
Bottom line, if Subaru offered a PHEV it would have been my first choice. However, the Outlander is basically the only choice in this segment and it is also very good. It has been refined over a number of years, and there is a lot of information available if you have issues.


2019 Subaru Crosstrek Hybrid will be available end of this month: https://www.subaru.com/vehicles/crosstrek/hybrid.html

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Possible future owner of 2020 Outlander PHEV SEL (USA)


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:14 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:42 pm
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Location: Ontario, Canada
Woodman411 wrote:
blweeden wrote:
Well that's interesting. And concerning!

I wonder what the reason for that is. It seems that the reliability of Mitsu products has been OK from some data I've seen, so ... curious.

I see you're a potential future owner, so maybe it hasn't warded you off entirely yet :).

Brian


3 words: Federal Tax Credit :) I'm actually more of a Toyota guy (if there was a plug-in RAV4 for 2-3 thousand more, I would get it). Whenever US gets the 13.8 kWh battery, that credit rises to $6,711, plus another $1,500 state (California), meaning at least an $8,000 difference to anything else that doesn't qualify. Also, as you mentioned, the reliability of the Outlander has been relatively good.

msmatt wrote:
Bottom line, if Subaru offered a PHEV it would have been my first choice. However, the Outlander is basically the only choice in this segment and it is also very good. It has been refined over a number of years, and there is a lot of information available if you have issues.


2019 Subaru Crosstrek Hybrid will be available end of this month: https://www.subaru.com/vehicles/crosstrek/hybrid.html


Sorry, I meant Outback PHEV! The Crosstrek is a little small, and it didn't give much improvement in fuel economy the first time they tried it as a hybrid. I agree, a plug-in RAV4 would probably be quite popular. Too bad Toyota mostly skipped PHEV's and jumped to the hydrogen fuel cell Mirai.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:03 am 
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Posts: 3252
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
Woodman411 wrote:
blweeden wrote:
Well that's interesting. And concerning!

I wonder what the reason for that is. It seems that the reliability of Mitsu products has been OK from some data I've seen, so ... curious.

I see you're a potential future owner, so maybe it hasn't warded you off entirely yet :).

Brian


3 words: Federal Tax Credit :)
I am somewhat confused. First you say lack of recurring repeat purchase and purchase loyalty is a tele tall sign on what to expect from the car. Then you say, the reason for scoring like it does is Federal Tax Credits, so it would say nothing for the car or the brand itself. I an also curious: to what extend is Mitsubishi already affected by this in the US? Did they have models that were subsidised earlier but not anymore?

In the Netherlands, in the first quarter of 2013 Mitsubishi sold about 20.000 PHEVs, where they had sold 2700 cars in 2012, counting all quarters and all models. The biggest incentive for the PHEV is now gone. Imagine where Mitsubishi would end up if they created such a list today. First you would see all the other brands. And then a few blank pages. And then, at the bottom of the very last page, would be Mitsubishi.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:07 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
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Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
msmatt wrote:
However the Mits quality has improved a lot from when I drove an earlier model Outlander in 2011.
I owned a 2010 Outlander Diesel before buying my 2013 PHEV and to me the 2010 felt much, much better. I think this has mostly to do with the effect of weight and cost savings on the body work. Compared to the 2010 car everything feels like it is made of aluminium foil with the 2013 car.

I can imagine the latest PHEVs have some improvements in the interior and in the drive train, but I assume the body work is mostly the same?


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 Post subject: Re: Do you guys like these things?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 2:47 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:32 pm
Posts: 1613
anko wrote:
msmatt wrote:
However the Mits quality has improved a lot from when I drove an earlier model Outlander in 2011.
I owned a 2010 Outlander Diesel before buying my 2013 PHEV and to me the 2010 felt much, much better. I think this has mostly to do with the effect of weight and cost savings on the body work. Compared to the 2010 car everything feels like it is made of aluminium foil with the 2013 car.

I can imagine the latest PHEVs have some improvements in the interior and in the drive train, but I assume the body work is mostly the same?


Well, I rear-ended a BMW M3 (at slow speed) on Friday - no damage to the PHEV. So must be heavy gauge foil at the front. :lol:


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