Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Forum

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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and what I have learnt.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:52 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Regulo wrote:
Trex wrote:
I'm so excited and I just can't hide it............ ;)


Are you about to lose control and like it though? :P


:lol: :lol:

No I do not think I will lose control but Hal the BMU computer (sorry :oops: AndyH for pinching your quote) may lose control when I hopefully reset him. :P

BTW how are you going Ray? With that signature about the nuclear-powered flying car always makes me remember you. :)

Regards Trex.


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
anko wrote:
Now sending 2115 to 761 (BMU) in my case gives back:

762 10 16 61 15 50 07 31 15
762 21 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
762 22 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
762 23 00 00 41 74 2F EC 41

Last BMU calibration procedure was done at 131.115 km. Dividing this number by 6.4 (*) yields 20.487 (after rounding). Converting that value to hex yields 0x5007, or bytes A+B. it seems bytes A-B have the odometer for last time procedure was performed.

The BMU calibration before that was done at 80.417 km. Dividing this number by 6.4 yields 12.565 (after rounding). Converting that value to hex yields 0x3115, or bytes C+D. it seems bytes A-B have the odometer for the previous time before that procedure was performed.

* It was a wild guess, but it gives us the hexadecimal representation of odometer in 0.1 km, but then shifted 5 bits to the right, to save space. This approach allows 'them' to register odometer reading up to 419.424 km, with an accuracy of 6.4 km, while using just two bytes :geek:


Hey anko. Want to reset your BMU as well? It might be worth a try. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:35 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3098
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
You are saying you know how?


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:24 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
anko wrote:
You are saying you know how?


Yep see your dealer and ask nicely. :lol:

But seriously, after asking mine what can be done to the BMU on the MUT-III he said Battery smoothing, BMU reset and BMU replace.

Tomorrow I hope to get mine reset and may be smoothing.


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:14 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Now in my first post in this thread I stated:

Trex wrote:

But the PHEV never fully discharges its drive battery. So how does it work out its capacity properly?

By "guessing" using algorithms I think.


So what data does the algorithms use for "guessing" the drive battery capacity in the PHEV?

I think they are using age and cycles and amount of charge and discharge of the drive battery as these are stored by the PHEV computers and show up in the reports.

Now Bert who I quoted in my first post here said:

Bert wrote:
Yes, the batteries capacity went back from 80.5% SoH to 99.7% with 38Ah. The first drive I did was 59km on pure EV, half of that on a highway. The very next day though I had already lost 0.1Ah again and until now (3 months later), I'm back to under 90% SoH...


Now notice that last bit about "The very next day though I had already lost 0.1Ah again and until now (3 months later), I'm back to under 90% SoH... "

How come he is, after a reset of the BMU, getting such a quick drop in battery health?

Well I think anko explained it when he said to me in another thread:

anko wrote:
Trex wrote:
anko wrote:
But my own tools tell me about 4900 or so. But these are also many partial charges.


Does it have an BMU data list number.?

Got a feeling I cannot find it because I am looking too hard. :lol:
No, it doen't. But it has a OBC data list number :P Kind a make sense as the OBC takes care of charging (at least A/C charging).


So the number of cycles charged is stored under the OBC data list and unless Bert got the OBC computer reset as well as the BMU computer reset he would be getting a quick reduction in battery health as this is ie cycles charged, one of the data used for "guessing" the capacity I think.

Tomorrow my PHEV goes in for drive battery tests and I hope to get the BMU and the OBC computers reset.

For people not knowing:

BMU Battery Management Unit
OBC OnBoard Charger

Regards Trex.


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 3:43 am 
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Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 9:07 am
Posts: 533
Location: N Yorks, UK
Any news Trex?
Cheers
H

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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Hypermiler wrote:
Any news Trex?
Cheers
H


Hi Hypermiler,

Only have a minute but the dealer cannot get his MUT-III or Multi Use Tester (Mitsubishi diagnostic device) to "talk" to my PHEV's BMU to do reset or Cell smoothing or Auto capacity measured procedure.

I could have a "faulty" BMU or the dealer may have a problem with his MUT-III. He can read data but not "write" data (for control purposes) to the BMU in my PHEV. The small dealer I am using has only 1 MUT device.

Now from what I have seen in the Workshop manuals the BMU is small box down the back of the PHEV near the right rear wheel-well and a person in Western Australia has had his BMU replaced on his PHEV.

He did NOT have battery problems but they replaced his BMU for a "EV system service required" error message.

This is what he quoted from another forum.

"We've had no further problems with our PHEV since that time. The fascinating sequel is that our range on battery has increased by about 20% since that repair! I regularly travel from home to our yacht in Fremantle, arriving there with between 5 and 12km residual range on battery (having driven the whole dist ance on battery alone), plug in at the Yacht Club and recharge (usually fully) and then drive home again, in the past arriving home with 10-15km left in the electric tank. Since the BMS was replaced, my fully charged, startup battery range is usually reported as 62km (up from 45km) and I now arrive at the Yacht Club with 20-25km left on battery range and arrive home with 25-30km left on battery range.

A week or so after getting the vehicle back from Melville Mitsubishi, I called them to tell them that my battery range had increased and to ask what they had done to achieve this. They couldn't explain my observations. I asked if perhaps my 2015 PHEV BMS had been replaced with a 2017 unit, but they were adamant this wasn't the case. I suspect that, notwithstanding the dealer's denial, this is what has happened. I understand the 2017 PHEV has better battery range compared with previous models and that this was achieved with better BMS software so in the absence of any other explanation, I'm going with this one."

So in his case a new BMU has helped get increased range so I am still thinking the BMU is getting out of "sync" with the real capacity of our batteries.

I have my PHEV back and am organising to take to another dealer towards the end of the month.

Will keep you all informed.

Regards Trex.


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Taken from Workshop manual showing the BMU location.

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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 6:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 606
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
This is from the same website as above but from their Technical information manual.

Image

Please note the Calculating total amount of battery (including capacity adjustment) using History of battery usage and History of discharge and charge
on the bottom left of the BMU.


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 Post subject: Re: Drive battery degradation and the out of whack IMO BMU.
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:53 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:59 pm
Posts: 42
Location: Lockyer Valley, QLD, Australia
Guys, I've posted mi findings already in another thread here and explained it also in some of my recent videos. After the procedure the total cycle count has not changed and the cars is not digging deeper into the lower 30% than before. Neither has the upper voltage changed and is still at 4.1V with a fully charged battery. The range though was incredible, so further assumptions need to be made what exactly happened... reset, calibration or smoothing? So far we have 3 cars here from Australia which have done this same procedure and went back to 100% SoH. I'm in email and forum contact with them to follow this up...

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