Snow Chains

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bwschimek

New member
Joined
May 9, 2018
Messages
4
Has anyone used snow chains on a 2018 in the United States? I live in California and we are required to carry chains in the vehicle even with 4WD. The owner's manual says not to use chains and I can't get an answer from the dealer. Thanks in advance.
 
Same in some parts of the Alps in France - but no need to actually use them just carry. So a bit of extra weight to carry around, that's all.
 
Seeing that it is more than unlikely that you will ever need them, if you use decent winter tyres, just get the cheapest used ones you can find. The PHEV can take normal chains without problem, though. the same in all Alpine countries, not just France
 
I have seen R3 controls (chains required on all vehicles with no exceptions) imposed once. So it IS possible that you will have to put them on.
 
This is the advice for my UK diesel in the manual

If snow traction device (tyre chains) have to
be used, ensure that they are fitted only on
the drive wheels (front) in accordance with
the manufacturer’s instructions.
On 4WD vehicles in which the driving power
is distributed preferentially to the front
wheels, ensure that the snow traction device
(tyre chains) are fitted on the front.
Use only snow traction device (tyre chains)
which are designed for use with the tyres
mounted on the vehicle: use of the incorrect
size or type of snow traction device (tyre
chains) could result in damage to the vehicle
body

It quotes a max size of 9mm
 
So, I tried to escalate this to the corporate level and could not get past their customer service representatives via telephone or an email. The bottom line from corporate is that chains cannot be put on the PHEV only the standard Outlander. They would not even let me talk with someone to make the suggestion for future PHEV models that are imported into the United States. I love the car but as far as this concern goes, their Customer Service really sucks. They have probably lost me as a customer when my lease runs out.
 
Okay I took a look at the actual page in the manual (9-19) that mentions tire chains. What it says is that tire chains (and by tire chains it means the traditional link type chains) cannot be used because there isn't enough clearance and they'll hit parts of the body/frame when you turn the tire from side to side. The exact quote is: "Tire chains cannot be used on your vehicle. The clearance between the chains and the body is not sufficient to allow proper clearance, and the vehicle body might be damaged."

It should be noted that cables are NOT chains! In fact, there are all types of snow traction products that meet SAE Class S requirements (which are specifically designed for vehicles with restricted clearances). These are the products that we'd want to use. Here's an example of one (note that this product does not require very much clearance around the tire, certainly much less than traditional chains with links): https://www.peerlesschain.com/brands/traction-product-choices/super-z/

By the way, if you chain up, put chains on ALL 4 wheels. The law requires just one axle (the driven axle) but these are AWD vehicles and both axles are driven, and though the law doesn't require you to chain all 4, having only 2 wheels chained is extremely dangerous, particularly if you put them up front. It's pretty easy to spin/fishtail if you hit a patch of ice at the wrong time.
 
chrisuk said:
This is the advice for my UK diesel in the manual

If snow traction device (tyre chains) have to
be used, ensure that they are fitted only on
the drive wheels (front) in accordance with
the manufacturer’s instructions.
On 4WD vehicles in which the driving power
is distributed preferentially to the front
wheels, ensure that the snow traction device
(tyre chains) are fitted on the front.
Use only snow traction device (tyre chains)
which are designed for use with the tyres
mounted on the vehicle: use of the incorrect
size or type of snow traction device (tyre
chains) could result in damage to the vehicle
body

It quotes a max size of 9mm
The Diesel version is a different car, not relevant on this forum.
 
STS134 said:
Okay I took a look at the actual page in the manual (9-19) that mentions tire chains. What it says is that tire chains (and by tire chains it means the traditional link type chains) cannot be used because there isn't enough clearance and they'll hit parts of the body/frame when you turn the tire from side to side. The exact quote is: "Tire chains cannot be used on your vehicle. The clearance between the chains and the body is not sufficient to allow proper clearance, and the vehicle body might be damaged."

It should be noted that cables are NOT chains! In fact, there are all types of snow traction products that meet SAE Class S requirements (which are specifically designed for vehicles with restricted clearances). These are the products that we'd want to use. Here's an example of one (note that this product does not require very much clearance around the tire, certainly much less than traditional chains with links): https://www.peerlesschain.com/brands/traction-product-choices/super-z/

By the way, if you chain up, put chains on ALL 4 wheels. The law requires just one axle (the driven axle) but these are AWD vehicles and both axles are driven, and though the law doesn't require you to chain all 4, having only 2 wheels chained is extremely dangerous, particularly if you put them up front. It's pretty easy to spin/fishtail if you hit a patch of ice at the wrong time.
Strangely enough, snow chains are allowed on the PHEV in Europe, albeit with restrictions on the thickness. If you actually look under the car, there is plenty of clearance, except with the steering at full lock. The answer is simple: don't use full lock in snow with chains on, something you wouldn't do anyway.
I think the USA restriction is caused by you guys living in litigator's paradise.
 
jaapv said:
STS134 said:
Okay I took a look at the actual page in the manual (9-19) that mentions tire chains. What it says is that tire chains (and by tire chains it means the traditional link type chains) cannot be used because there isn't enough clearance and they'll hit parts of the body/frame when you turn the tire from side to side. The exact quote is: "Tire chains cannot be used on your vehicle. The clearance between the chains and the body is not sufficient to allow proper clearance, and the vehicle body might be damaged."

It should be noted that cables are NOT chains! In fact, there are all types of snow traction products that meet SAE Class S requirements (which are specifically designed for vehicles with restricted clearances). These are the products that we'd want to use. Here's an example of one (note that this product does not require very much clearance around the tire, certainly much less than traditional chains with links): https://www.peerlesschain.com/brands/traction-product-choices/super-z/

By the way, if you chain up, put chains on ALL 4 wheels. The law requires just one axle (the driven axle) but these are AWD vehicles and both axles are driven, and though the law doesn't require you to chain all 4, having only 2 wheels chained is extremely dangerous, particularly if you put them up front. It's pretty easy to spin/fishtail if you hit a patch of ice at the wrong time.
Strangely enough, snow chains are allowed on the PHEV in Europe, albeit with restrictions on the thickness. If you actually look under the car, there is plenty of clearance, except with the steering at full lock. The answer is simple: don't use full lock in snow with chains on, something you wouldn't do anyway.
I think the USA restriction is caused by you guys living in litigator's paradise.

Just use SAE Class S products, like the Z Chain or the Super Z. It's super easy to install and remove, way easier than traditional chains. I can get them on in around 30 seconds/tire.
 
Similar to Alpes, Here is what CHP says:

Chain Requirements

R1: Chains are required - snow tread tires allowed.
R2: Chains are required on all vehicles except four wheel drive vehicles with snow tires on all four wheels.
R3: Chains are required - all vehicles - no exceptions.

R1 and R2 are the most common conditions. The highway is usually closed before an R3 condition is imposed.

http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/roadinfo/wo.htm

The Toyo tire we have is (M+S) so no chains are required in R1/R2 but we still need to show CHP that we are carrying one just in case conditions worse to R3. I got an almost undersized chain and test fitted without the clearance issue.

Please keep in mind this is the minimum to pass CHP inspection. Doesn’t mean is safe...

I don’t have real world experience yet. It has been snowing in the mountains for two weekend straight and my daughters have been under weather one after another.
Tai
 

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Tai626 said:
Please keep in mind this is the minimum to pass CHP inspection. Doesn’t mean is safe...

IMHO the ONLY safe way to drive when there's chain requirements is with ALL 4 WHEELS chained. I once was driving into the southern entrance of Yosemite on CA-41 and there were R-2 controls in place. I had chained my front axle (the drive wheels on my previous car) and was coming down a slight hill where the road turned to the right. I hit a patch of ice and I took my foot off the gas and did not even touch the brakes; my car still spun around 180 degrees and ended up in the oncoming traffic lane facing the other direction, as if I were driving the opposite way. If there had been oncoming traffic, there wouldn't have been anything I could have done to avoid it; fortunately there was almost no one on the road that day. If I had had a bit more momentum, I would have gone down the embankment. So yeah, chaining only one axle is extremely dangerous.
 
Slightly off topic perhaps but I have just bought a PHEV and looked at chains because I have an unused set from my previous car (BMW 530D) and was hoping to be able to use then if needed on the PHEV. The requirement in the EU Owners handbook is to have a chain size of 9mm or less.
I was in Canada a couple of year ago visiting my son-in-law, who is a Mountie, and commented on the number of 4x4's 'parked on the berm' but very two 2 wheel drive cars and so asked him why that was - his answer was interesting.
The Mounties use mostly the typical 'Crown' cars even in winter but they are taught to drive according to the road conditions, but the attitude of many 4x4 drivers is that they do NOT have to drive with extreme care and watching for icy patches. On ice simple physics tells you the inertia of the vehicle takes control and steering has only a marginal effect. On ICE it matters not whether you have 2 or 4 wheel drive and with chains or not. They all slide but 4x4 drivers often think it doesn't apply to them.
 
Hi, I used the information on this topic to purchase and use snow chains this past weekend in the Yosemite area (California) which was under R-2 restrictions. I have a 2018 Outlander PHEV and do not have mud and snow tires. I purchased these chains from Amazon: Security Chain Company SZ143 Super Z6 Cable Tire Chain for Passenger Cars, Pickups, and SUVs - Set of 2. I put them on all 4 tires after reading that that's the safest configuration for 4WD. The chains were easy and fast to install and worked fine even with less clearance. I love that you don't have to move the car to put these chains on and they self-tighten.

Hopefully this update helps someone else.
 
thefishnets said:
Slightly off topic perhaps but I have just bought a PHEV and looked at chains because I have an unused set from my previous car (BMW 530D) and was hoping to be able to use then if needed on the PHEV. The requirement in the EU Owners handbook is to have a chain size of 9mm or less.
I was in Canada a couple of year ago visiting my son-in-law, who is a Mountie, and commented on the number of 4x4's 'parked on the berm' but very two 2 wheel drive cars and so asked him why that was - his answer was interesting.
The Mounties use mostly the typical 'Crown' cars even in winter but they are taught to drive according to the road conditions, but the attitude of many 4x4 drivers is that they do NOT have to drive with extreme care and watching for icy patches. On ice simple physics tells you the inertia of the vehicle takes control and steering has only a marginal effect. On ICE it matters not whether you have 2 or 4 wheel drive and with chains or not. They all slide but 4x4 drivers often think it doesn't apply to them.

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