johnwilson
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:21 pm

2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:33 pm

Hi, First time posting here. We have a PHEV with 65,000 km on it and it started acting up last year. It could not be forced into EV mode when it was below 10C out, which is a lot of the year here. We took it in for a recall of the engine start relay ( it apparently could freeze resulting in the problem we were experiencing). It seemed that the repair fixed the problem and we were able to run in ev as long as we did not use the defrost. In November of 2020 it started acting up again and would always start the engine below 10c, no matter what we did. We took it to the dealer and they said nothing was wrong with it. I contacted MM Canada and they said that nothing was wrong with it . Their position is contradicted by the manual, which says you can run it in ev as long as the defrost in not depressed. So we have been running the car as an ICE car for the last 5 months and really dont know where to turn.

Any suggestions?
Thanks,
John Wilson

jaapv
Posts: 4586
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:50 am

I don't really know about the later models (yet ;) ) but at low temperatures under 10º C the car will start the ICE to provide cabin heating.
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greendwarf
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Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:31 am

With due respect to jaapv his reply is misleading. The car can run on EV under 10c - I do it every day in Winter - but it is at the expense of cabin heating i.e. I have to have the internal temperature set to minimum (and wear a thick & gloves :lol: ).

The "problem" is that the car is designed to reserve the battery charge for propulsion at the expense of everything else. So if you want to be warm in low temperatures then the car will run the ICE. The only way of dealing with this in the short term is to pre-heat the cabin via the wifi control just before you set off. If you do this whilst still plugged into a charger you should be able to "top up" the battery at the same time - so you leave with a warm car and full battery in ev mode.

johnwilson
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:21 pm

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 4:36 am

Thank you for the replies. My problem however is that for the first two years the car responded as the manual for the car said it would and that is when the temperature was low in our case below 3C, the engine would start if the defrost button was depressed even when the car was in ev mode, but if you started the car in ev and did not depress the defrost button, you could operate it in ev, until you accelerated agressively or ran at high speed. We were always able to run it in ev mode no matter how low the temperature.
Now the car starts the ice at any temperature and will only go to ev after the ice is up to operating temperature and even then it will return to ice if the outside temperature is 10c or below after the ice has cooled a bit.
Very frustrating as we are not able to use the charge unless we are going for a 100km or more trip, then the ev mode will gradually use up the battery.
This makes the ownership of a PHEV pretty much equivalent to a non plug in hybrid.

oscarmax
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2018 3:47 am

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:16 am

jaapv wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:50 am
I don't really know about the later models (yet ;) ) but at low temperatures under 10º C the car will start the ICE to provide cabin heating.
I have noticed our is about 6 degrees C, in the early days it was a big thing, now with a bit more owner experience I don't worry
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kpetrov
Posts: 88
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 8:59 am

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:51 am

johnwilson wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:33 pm
Hi, First time posting here. We have a PHEV with 65,000 km on it and it started acting up last year. It could not be forced into EV mode when it was below 10C out, which is a lot of the year here...

Any suggestions?
Thanks,
John Wilson
John, same here. I didn't own it the winter before the recall of the engine start relay and can't be 100% sure but you are the sixth person that report no EV availability after this recall. They are performing and BMU update in the same time.
I have made the mistake to submit my vehicle to this recall and once the temp. hit 5 Celsius the engine will warm up itself no matter what.
I am now confident they are intentionally doing it in order to reduce the claims under warranty (engine cold damages).
You can blame them without any remorse.
2018 Outlander PHEV (Canadian)

johnwilson
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:21 pm

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:25 am

Hi Kpetrov, The dealer is making me feel like a madman. After they installed the new relay, the car worked perfectly until summer. We couldnt tell whether there was a problem over the summer because of no under 10 C temps. Come October however it was apparent that the car could not be forced into ev and the problem has only got worse with little to no ev use on trips up to 60 km.
This renders the car totally inefficient on trips to the gym or just into town.
The dealer can not decide what the story is; whether it was the relay or a software change. I contacted the mechanic today and he said it was done to protect the battery, but not having ev functionality below 10c ( he says 13c) renders the phev ability useless for half the year where we live.
In addition he said that they charge to balance the battery ( 280 dollars) . Our car has 65K on it and I would think that that would be a warranty issue on equipment that makes the car move.
The manual says that forcing into ev is a normal thing and MM Canada has removed basic functionality of the car.
What are your thoughts? Where can I read about the problem the other 6 car owners have had and why are there only 6 problems. The dealer says that I am the only customer having this problem.
Thanks,
John

oscarmax
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2018 3:47 am

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Tue Mar 09, 2021 11:39 am

In the UK the area were we live the winter temperatures are quite mild, with the outside temperature at near zero or slightly below even without pre heating, If the heating is in the off position, press the EV button then switch on the heater it uses the battery.

I
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jaapv
Posts: 4586
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:30 am

If you run the car until everything has heated up, or after keeping the car in a heated garage, does it do EV then?
This is basically normal behaviour. Under 10º the ICE will start up and run for a few kms to heat up the engine to prevent further deep cold starts at high revs and to provide initial heating -except for the older model trick described by Greendwarf. The lower the outside temperature, the longer it will run, despite the EV switch being activated - the switch is not an absolute one, if the software deems it necessary it will be overridden. I don't know what the settings are in extremely cold climates. It may well be that Mitsubishi has different parameters for different local conditions.
We do know from European winters, e.g Poland and Norway, that the lower the temperature, the more the car starts behaving like a normal hybrid and the less like an EV. At a certain point it will run on ICE only, there is even a cut-off temperature (-30º IIRC, but I may be wrong) that it won't run at all.
This is not done to protect the battery, but is caused by declining battery capacity with lower temperatures.
You are right that this type of car is not very suitable for extremely cold conditions unless it has battery heating.
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jaapv
Posts: 4586
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:18 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: 2018 Canadian PHEV wont run in ev.

Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:41 am

greendwarf wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:31 am
With due respect to jaapv his reply is misleading. The car can run on EV under 10c - I do it every day in Winter - but it is at the expense of cabin heating i.e. I have to have the internal temperature set to minimum (and wear a thick & gloves :lol: ).

The "problem" is that the car is designed to reserve the battery charge for propulsion at the expense of everything else. So if you want to be warm in low temperatures then the car will run the ICE. The only way of dealing with this in the short term is to pre-heat the cabin via the wifi control just before you set off. If you do this whilst still plugged into a charger you should be able to "top up" the battery at the same time - so you leave with a warm car and full battery in ev mode.
Yes, that is true for the old model. I'll experiment with the new model (I got mine with the 2.4 engine and EV switch only yesterday). Night temperatures are still below 10º so it should be easy to find out.
I'm not as spartan as you are with bobble hat and skiing gloves, I am quite happy to let the car do its heating and ICE preserving thing, and switch on the seat heater as well. :lol: I find the preheating impractical; I do not leave at fixed times and the app is an abomination.
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