First test of 19,5 kWh battery in PHEV

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vtechtuning

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 16, 2015
Messages
64
Location
Krakow, Poland
I have built prototype of higher capacity battery, by replacing factory modules of 8xL40 with my modules, built from chinese cheap cells (as this is prototype, I wanted to test if it works) of 19,5 kWh total installed inside factory battery (I have spare one - thx Anko :) ). Factory BMS handles this (with small tweak). I cannot say that first tests are full success (some issues while driving like - car is not regen at all for first 20 km of drive) but it more or less works. Some videos soon.
 
Nice work vtechtuning - very much looking forward to seeing those videos. Cheers!!
 
vtechtuning
Please can you indicate what your objectives are, if any, other than increased range.
Have you increased the maximum charge/discharge rate?
If so, will their be any additional battery power available before the ICE starts (during acceleration), and can the charging rate be adjusted from standard, to give similar charge time.
Also does your new battery pack weigh much more.
thanks Ian
 
Great news!
100 km range, which is probably possible with this setup, is the minimum I consider practical in my case.
 
PolishPilot said:
Great news!
100 km range, which is probably possible with this setup, is the minimum I consider practical in my case.

52 / 12 * 19.5 = 84.5. Why would you think 100 km is possible?

Unless, the low water mark for recharging is not kept at 30% but at 3.6 kW. In that case, the equation becomes:

52 / 8.4 * 15.9 = 98.4 :lol:

But that is all in theory, based on the brochure values.
 
vtechtuning said:
I have built prototype of higher capacity battery, by replacing factory modules of 8xL40 with my modules, built from chinese cheap cells (as this is prototype, I wanted to test if it works) of 19,5 kWh total installed inside factory battery (I have spare one - thx Anko :) ). Factory BMS handles this (with small tweak). I cannot say that first tests are full success (some issues while driving like - car is not regen at all for first 20 km of drive) but it more or less works. Some videos soon.

How easy is to gain access to the car battery pack?

Something that everybody can do, it are needed specials equipment?

How is handled the electronic around the battery pack?

Is there already a "balancer" of the cells while charging ? Or this is integrated into the battery pack?

Thanks in advance

e_lm_70

ps: How much did cost you to build your battery pack ?

pps: Just did a little math ... using 20USD HobbyKing Multistart 5200mAh 4S ... one of the 10 block would be costing 320USD .. and the full battery pack replacement will be 3200 USD ... not even too bad .. but what is shocking is the difference in weight ... only 68KG for build the 12.3KWh pack ... vs 180kg :eek:
 
Just a curiosity, is the battery level bar on the dashboard related to battery voltage? So that it indicates the battery level for any battery?
Thank you vtech.
 
george said:
Just a curiosity, is the battery level bar on the dashboard related to battery voltage? So that it indicates the battery level for any battery?
Thank you vtech.

Via OSB apps can know the voltage for each of the 80 50mAh battery in the car.

I would expect that there is some "balancing" happening .. else one single cell can be over discharged or over charged .. sp the total bettery voltage is a good indication

The battery level on the dashboard is a tricky "beast" ... when shown 0, in reality battery level is 25% ... and possible .. battery are never fully charged too ... so .. shown 0% is 25% real .. shown 100% is possible 80% real ... and for show this "tricky" beast .. it is only needed the total voltage output .. (4.25V per cell is 100% ... ~3.3v is 0% .. not 100% it can be consider liner)

People that own the right app (it cost around 20USD) can have a more acurate figures about what is shown in dash board based on the battery voltage

Note .. that under load .. battery voltage goes down .. making hard to predict battery capacity under load ... so .. I guess the PEHV must have some logic here .. it may even count the ammount of current used and use this info for update the dashboard

PS: I'm using Lithoum battery since over 10 years on RC models ... and predict the battery capacity left .. for avoid losing an RC model due to missing power ... and as well ... over charge and over discharge, plus other factor .. effect the Lithium battery life .. and these battery are relative expensive also in the RC model world ... even if price did sink a lot in the last years ...
 
I've seen that the pack has a 350 Amp fuse at the output line and a 70Amp fuse in the Chademo line so even with a bigger pack we can`t go over 100kW of output power and 21kW of Chademo no?
 
Esparza said:
I've seen that the pack has a 350 Amp fuse at the output line and a 70Amp fuse in the Chademo line so even with a bigger pack we can`t go over 100kW of output power and 21kW of Chademo no?

How did you see it?

Did you got access to the battery or you have access to a electric car schema ?
 
Keep it up :) . This will become more and more interesting over time as a: battery packs will start to age and will need replacement and b: new battery technology becomes available and batteries become obsolete. We will need specialists to keep our cars on the road.
 
jaapv said:
Keep it up :) . This will become more and more interesting over time as a: battery packs will start to age and will need replacement and b: new battery technology becomes available and batteries become obsolete. We will need specialists to keep our cars on the road.

I would love to get photos of the battery pack, and some photo about how to access them.

I'm even not sure which is the location in the outlander ... in some diagram are shown under the floor of the entire car ... but in some video I heard it has been stated that these are under the back sits

I know only vtech that already manage to replace battery ... but ... he did disclose quite little about the process

Clearly .. since battery have a 300V DC ... they are lethal weapons .. so ... I expect this operation done only by professionals

I expect vtech may consider as business to offer battery upgrade and maintenance ... but considering the 5y warranties over battery from Mitsubishi .. and the not excessive market size .. it is a questionable business if it will ever happen .. but if .. it will be only in 2 years for now I would guess

I believe ... excluding the risk of 300v shock .. and assuming an easy access to the battery compartment .. replace batteries should not be a very complicated task ... as I did estimated before .. taking hobby grade LiPo ... make a 13Kwh battery pack cost "only" 3200 USD ... but .. I expect that most of time .. in case of ageing .. only 1 or 2 cells are weak and only replacing them we could get back most of the life of the battery pack (the weaker cell is the one that will dictate the full battery capacity) .. for check this .. it maybe mandatory to use advance OSB2 tools .. since unfortunately MMCS does not show each single battery :oops:
 
I seem to remember being told that the UK battery warranty is for 10 years or 200,000 km. I didn't investigate closely, because my car is on a 3-year lease, and I do << 40,000 miles a year :)
 
elm70 said:
How did you see it?

Did you got access to the battery or you have access to a electric car schema ?

I've access to a eletric car schema :)
I will open it but is still on warranty
 
Esparza said:
elm70 said:
How did you see it?

Did you got access to the battery or you have access to a electric car schema ?

I've access to a eletric car schema :)
I will open it but is still on warranty

Can you share the schema with us ?
 
I downloaded it from a post in this forum :D

I don´t know how to attach it here but i can send it by mail.
 
Esparza said:
I downloaded it from a post in this forum :D

I don´t know how to attach it here but i can send it by mail.

You have my email address on you PM

Thanks in advance ;)
 
Retrofit with more energy dense battery cells will be a good option when the original battery will lose power in the future.
I do not think that MMC will see the business case and offer a battery upgrade with more than 12kWh capacity...
 
vtechtuning said:
I have built prototype of higher capacity battery, by replacing factory modules of 8xL40 with my modules, built from chinese cheap cells (as this is prototype, I wanted to test if it works) of 19,5 kWh total installed inside factory battery (I have spare one - thx Anko :) ). Factory BMS handles this (with small tweak). I cannot say that first tests are full success (some issues while driving like - car is not regen at all for first 20 km of drive) but it more or less works. Some videos soon.

Please, how is the test progressing?
 
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