Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Forum

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2019 3:28 am 
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Location: Netherlands
Especially if you drive both manual and automatic/EV vehicles. Sadly, the art of shifting gears is getting lost. Double Clutching is becoming an esoteric art, as is Heel-and-Toeing, let alone operating a crash-box. I am getting to be one of the few drivers who can shift gears without touching the clutch. Came in handy a few years ago when a rubber in the clutch hydraulics gave way a long way from home. The only giveaway is the jump when starting the car in second gear. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2019 6:25 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:18 am
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Location: Yorkshire end of M1, UK
I taught myself to brake with my left foot when I first got an automatic many years ago, and only once had a minor issue soon after I started. I was much younger then and wouldn't try to learn it now (old dog, new tricks), but I still don't find I have any problem switching between driving with 2 pedals or 3. YMMV

I have had a problem a couple of times with manuals in some sports cars: the racier ones used to have first out on its own, left and back, opposite reverse. I did occasionally set off in reverse from a standstill, as left and forward is a very difficult habit to forget with a manual gearbox. Thank heavens I never did it when I was in a hurry, as a rapid start in reverse is not a good idea in a queue of traffic!

A problem that the PHEV has introduced for me is when I can simply switch it off and it goes into Park. Our Zoe has a gearlever physically connected to the mechanism: I only drive it occasionally, but it beeps at me furiously if I forget to shift it into Park when I switch it off. And I'm starting to forget to get the key out in cars that don't have smart keys... :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2019 12:41 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:37 am
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Location: Bucks
MadTechNutter wrote:
BTW I could never use the left foot for braking as I always used it for the clutch. It is just wrong for me to be able to press the brake and accelerator at the same time.

Yes, as others have pointed out, my (the wife's!) other car is a manual, so learning to left-foot brake would be a bad habit. It's surprising how easy it is for the mind to switch from one car to the other, though I (very) occasionally forget I need to depress the clutch when coming to a stop in the manual.

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2019 1:13 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2019 7:35 pm
Posts: 118
Location: Aussie Land
ThudnBlundr wrote:
I have had a problem a couple of times with manuals in some sports cars: the racier ones used to have first out on its own, left and back, opposite reverse. I did occasionally set off in reverse from a standstill, as left and forward is a very difficult habit to forget with a manual gearbox. Thank heavens I never did it when I was in a hurry, as a rapid start in reverse is not a good idea in a queue of traffic!

A problem that the PHEV has introduced for me is when I can simply switch it off and it goes into Park. Our Zoe has a gearlever physically connected to the mechanism: I only drive it occasionally, but it beeps at me furiously if I forget to shift it into Park when I switch it off. And I'm starting to forget to get the key out in cars that don't have smart keys... :oops:



I still have troubles after 2 months with my PHEV starting in reverse sometimes.
First gear has always been for me moving the shifter forwards, why does the PHEV then go in reverse when I push it forwards.
There is no logic here.
It should be push forwards for forwards and pull back for reverse.
I drive RC cars and can fly my drone like that.

...bloody automatics :evil:

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:29 am 
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Location: Netherlands
I think it is standard for automatic transmissions and similar.

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2019 4:02 am 
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Location: Yorkshire end of M1, UK
Not really. The standard for automatics for many decades was "PRND(21)", pulling back or down from 'P' into 'R' and further back for 'D'. I'm not sure what it is now with 8 or 9-speed auto gearboxes, but our Zoe is 'PRND' too, as was a Toyota C-HR Hybrid we were given as a hire car on holiday. I can't think of an obvious reason for the PHEV's layout

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:43 am 
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It's Japanese! Same reason their motorbikes do everything the opposite way round to European ones :)

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:08 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:47 am
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Location: Hampshire - UK
In my experience, the dealer was stupid! 3.5 years ago when I was looking for my previous company car, the Mitsu salesman told me that my 20 miles each way commute was unsuitable for the PHEV as I would be using some petrol. Perhaps that's why the Reading dealership isn't there any more.

I took him at his word and got a diesel BMW. In lost fuel and income tax savings, he cost me several thousand pounds :-(((((((((((

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Last edited by Dondon on Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:42 am 
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ThudnBlundr wrote:
Not really. The standard for automatics for many decades was "PRND(21)", pulling back or down from 'P' into 'R' and further back for 'D'. I'm not sure what it is now with 8 or 9-speed auto gearboxes, but our Zoe is 'PRND' too, as was a Toyota C-HR Hybrid we were given as a hire car on holiday. I can't think of an obvious reason for the PHEV's layout

Well, given that the home position for the PHEV is "N" , with "P" a pushbutton, I think it behaves exactly the same.

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 Post subject: Re: Are dealers simply ignorant, or dishonest?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:34 am 
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jaapv wrote:
ThudnBlundr wrote:
Not really. The standard for automatics for many decades was "PRND(21)", pulling back or down from 'P' into 'R' and further back for 'D'. I'm not sure what it is now with 8 or 9-speed auto gearboxes, but our Zoe is 'PRND' too, as was a Toyota C-HR Hybrid we were given as a hire car on holiday. I can't think of an obvious reason for the PHEV's layout

Well, given that the home position for the PHEV is "N" , with "P" a pushbutton, I think it behaves exactly the same.


The PRND(3)21 setup is mode selector, while the RND on the PHEV is a joystick with a neutral center.
I understand that it has been derived from the selector of automatic cars but this is actually not the same. The selector function in automatics doesn't confuse me but this two way 'joystick' does.

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