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 Post subject: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:18 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:52 am
Posts: 28
On the way home from a 50 mile trip at the weekend I wanted to see how much range I still had when the "Refuel" message appears on the dash. With a flat battery, so running mostly on petrol, I had then done around 30 miles (so had reached the original predicted range before the REFUEL message blanks out the range estimation to --:--

At this point my wife was nervous that we'd run out of fuel on the motorway, and not having a jerry can, we decided to rapid charge at a nearby services. My plan was to use the 80% battery as "reserve" and use "Save" mode to continue to force petrol use until I ran out.

However, only when I rejoined the motorway did I realise that Save mode is disabled when you're low on fuel, which kind of scuppered my experiment as the next 20 or so miles were EV and didn't use any petrol at all!

This is probably in the manual somewhere, but just a warning to others.

Is there any way to "force" save mode?

Cheers

Neil


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 4:25 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 5:25 am
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Location: South Australia
I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range. Had a jerry can so was only worried about the Turtle mode appearing. SAVE mode became disabled in my testing as well.

When on a longer drive, I always tried to use SAVE mode, and I finally made a mod to allow my PHEV to either power ON in SAVE, or CHARGE or NORMAL mode. There are the critics and EV purists with opinions that differ from mine re the benefits this may have.

If you have a corded recharging source available at the end of any journey, then using the battery before the last of the fuel can be accessed should not pose too much a problem. Just need to reset a trip meter at the right time to work out how far you have gone. I find it easier now to just carry 10L of fuel and refuel if needed and not just fully drain the battery to access the last fuel in the tank. I don't always have a corded recharge available at the end of a drive.

Have not found any way to defeat this mode of operation and can't see a benefit to do so.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 4:32 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:46 am
Posts: 3033
gwatpe wrote:
I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range. Had a jerry can so was only worried about the Turtle mode appearing. SAVE mode became disabled in my testing as well.

When on a longer drive, I always tried to use SAVE mode, and I finally made a mod to allow my PHEV to either power ON in SAVE, or CHARGE or NORMAL mode. There are the critics and EV purists with opinions that differ from mine re the benefits this may have.

If you have a corded recharging source available at the end of any journey, then using the battery before the last of the fuel can be accessed should not pose too much a problem. Just need to reset a trip meter at the right time to work out how far you have gone. I find it easier now to just carry 10L of fuel and refuel if needed and not just fully drain the battery to access the last fuel in the tank. I don't always have a corded recharge available at the end of a drive.

Have not found any way to defeat this mode of operation and can't see a benefit to do so.


Quite agree - if you did manage to fully drain the tank, it just means that you have to put more in on the next fill, so why try to force the issue?


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:45 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3404
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
Interestingly enough, it will not use fuel to propel the car, but it will use fuel to heat the car :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:57 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 11:16 am
Posts: 21
Location: Yorkshire
Hi,
I experienced this the other week. Ran out of fuel a few miles before the end of the motorway on the way to Portsmouth. Save dropped out automatically and I did the rest of the journey on battery. Luckily, I just made a fuel station with 3 miles to spare :!:

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:07 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3404
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
Don't think you ran out of fuel. You just hit the reserve. Ho much were you able to add?


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:41 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 11:16 am
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Location: Yorkshire
anko wrote:
Don't think you ran out of fuel. You just hit the reserve. Ho much were you able to add?

Hi,
I was definitely out of reserve as well because the engine wasn't running at all, looking at the driver information display.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 12:21 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3404
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
That doesn't mean anything.

When you run in save or charge mode, with 5 liters of petrol left, the engine dies out and you are forced to empty the battery first (I think the engine may be started again when you really push it. Turning up the heat in absence of an electric heater or with to much of a temp difference may start it, that's for sure). Then when the battery is near lowest of the lowest, the engine starts again, and you can burn the last 5 liters of fuel. When all the fuel is gone, then you can use up the very last bit of SOC and then it is all over.

From what you wrote, it doesn't sound like you've reached that point.


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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:17 am 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 11:16 am
Posts: 21
Location: Yorkshire
anko wrote:
That doesn't mean anything.

When you run in save or charge mode, with 5 liters of petrol left, the engine dies out and you are forced to empty the battery first (I think the engine may be started again when you really push it. Turning up the heat in absence of an electric heater or with to much of a temp difference may start it, that's for sure). Then when the battery is near lowest of the lowest, the engine starts again, and you can burn the last 5 liters of fuel. When all the fuel is gone, then you can use up the very last bit of SOC and then it is all over.

From what you wrote, it doesn't sound like you've reached that point.


Oh, right. So, I suffered my own little "range anxiety" period for nothing!! I was just reacting to no blue thermometer bar for fuel and only dashes for range left. I'm not sure I'm going to let it get down that far again, but thanks for all your help and reassurance.

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 Post subject: Re: Save mode disabled when low on fuel
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2015 4:32 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:52 am
Posts: 28
gwatpe wrote:
I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range.


160km is quite impressive.

From refuelling shortly after --:-- range is displayed I found that I have approx 5L of petrol remaining.

The overly cautious refuelling warnings certainly mean people are making far more fuel stops that really necessary on long journeys. One should be maximising this period when the car is most efficient with lower fuel levels (less dead weight)

Cheers

Neil


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