Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Forum

It is currently Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:25 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 67 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2015 2:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Image

Here we have our petrol motor's torque and power plots.

From about 120kph and up the PHEV will go into Parallel mode from Series mode regardless because there is more power available from the petrol motor if it is directly coupled to front wheels than getting the power through the generator in Series mode. Below about 120kph, down to 65kph, if more power and is needed from the petrol motor than it can produce in Parallel mode (if already in Parallel mode) it will drop back into Series mode. You can see the effect in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbOmtzFj14M

Watch center display between power gauge and speedo gauge and see how it goes from Series mode into Parallel mode at about 120kph.

Of course his foot is flat to the floor on the accelerator. :lol:

Regards Trex.

Material from MMC and GtoGarrett on youtube.


Last edited by Trex on Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:49 pm, edited 8 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2015 3:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3043
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
Hey, what happened to the credits? :mrgreen:

I don't think dashed lines are for serial mode. They show what you would get if parallel mode would engage at lower speeds. And thereby why parallel mode doesn't engage at lower speeds: not enough grunt.

The whole idea of serial mode isto allow the engine to make more revs and generate more power and torque while doing so.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
anko wrote:
Hey, what happened to the credits? :mrgreen:

I don't think dashed lines are for serial mode. They show what you would get if parallel mode would engage at lower speeds. And thereby why parallel mode doesn't engage at lower speeds: not enough grunt.

The whole idea of serial mode isto allow the engine to make more revs and generate more power and torque while doing so.


Hey anko,

:oops: Sorry old mate I will fix up the post straight away about the credits. I knew I forgot something. :lol: :lol:

If you look hard at the bottom of the graph you can just make out the words that I wrote.

I think it has something to do with the hv battery being less then < 30%. Can you check or translate what they are trying to say. We can edit it later.

Regards Trex.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2015 9:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Image

Engine differences.

Image from MMC.

Regards Trex.


Last edited by Trex on Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2015 12:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:30 am
Posts: 3043
Location: Netherlands, Utrecht area
Trex wrote:
If you look hard at the bottom of the graph you can just make out the words that I wrote.

I think it has something to do with the hv battery being less then < 30%. Can you check or translate what they are trying to say. We can edit it later.

Regards Trex.
You are right. It says so in the graph. I did not see that first. But it doesn't change the way I look at it: in serial mode, engine RPM is independent of vehicle speed and so is (within limits) engine output in terms of power and torque.

The document is a bit confusing. First, there are two tables, which I have combined into a single picture:

Image
If you take into account tire size and gear ratios you can translate speeds into e-motor RPMs and thus torques into kWs. What the first table tells you is that with SOC>30% the e-motors can deliver 120 kW max (as of 55 km/h).

The second table table tells you that with SOC<30% the amount of torque at 55 km/h is half of what it is at SOC>30%. This would translate into max 60 kW. This suggests that with SOC<30% no power is drawn from the battery, only from the generator.

But in the text it says that at SOC<20% support from the battery is reduced and you will have max 60 kW / 135 Nm at 65 km/h, all coming from the generator. From the text and my own experience, I think the captions for the tables are wrong. I think the first table is for SOC>20% and the second for SOC<20% (Turtle mode).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2015 7:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
Hi anko,

Thanks for sorting that out for us. I agree it should be <20% as from the first graph on page 1 of this discussion.

I have adjusted the graph above with green and yellow lines to take into consideration what you mean about the variable output of the generator in Series mode showing max output of generator, after losses, in Series mode.

I think those blue and red dashed lines are for lowest loading of the petrol motor (or generator) in Serial mode . I notice in my Phev that at 60kph the petrol motor never seems to stop running as though the generator is not putting out enough output to charge the hv battery for ev mode later ie no start (charge) stop (ev mode) of petrol motor at 60kph.

Regards Trex.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:30 am
Posts: 188
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
Fantastic work Trex, and Anko..... It gives us a real understanding of the technical side of our cars!

Keep it up and get all the technicality you need!

What I would love is a better view of a cell of the battery. If that's possible of course?

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 3:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
thegurio wrote:
Fantastic work Trex, and Anko..... It gives us a real understanding of the technical side of our cars!

Keep it up and get all the technicality you need!

What I would love is a better view of a cell of the battery. If that's possible of course?


On my behalf thanks for the kind words.

Will see if we can come up with something on the battery cell to put in this sticky.

Regards Trex.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 5:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:30 am
Posts: 188
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
Trex wrote:
thegurio wrote:
Fantastic work Trex, and Anko..... It gives us a real understanding of the technical side of our cars!

Keep it up and get all the technicality you need!

What I would love is a better view of a cell of the battery. If that's possible of course?


On my behalf thanks for the kind words.

Will see if we can come up with something on the battery cell to put in this sticky.

Regards Trex.


No problems, I could only imagine the effort that went in to producing it... Thanks in advance if you can get it.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Technical graphs and images
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 7:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 5:58 pm
Posts: 605
Location: Near Port Macquarie Australia
A new item,

Image

This is something I have been working on for a while and I hope it makes sense. It is basically a combination of the previous graphs plotted at the axles. Thanks for your help with this anko.

Regards Trex.


Last edited by Trex on Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 67 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
© Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Forum - part of the MyElectricCarForums.com Group