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Charge at your local filling station
- Thread starter MikeK
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jaapv
Well-known member
I suppose these would need to be CHAdeMO chargers.
greendwarf
Well-known member
Some Irish petrol stations already have chargers :mrgreen:
I think that the time it takes to charge to 80% and then gain the possible 20 miles driving distance has a limited usefulness for me.
Right, my meds are kicking-in and I am going off on one, bear with my ramblings, but what if:-
If we had a battery that had a range of at least 100 miles and could be made to be easily inter-changeable, then if Mitsubishi joined forces with a petrol supplier e.g. Shell then they could offer a battery lease option were you could turn up at a Shell forecourt and change your depleted battery for a freshly charged one, and if they really got their heads around it they could have an industry standard battery that could be fitted across manufacturers. This would also alleviate any worries about battery degredation over time as the leased batteries could have a minimum serviceable capacity of 85-90%
I know that is a lot of what-ifs and pie in the sky and I will add it to my list of things I would like along with hover-boots and world peace.
Right, my meds are kicking-in and I am going off on one, bear with my ramblings, but what if:-
If we had a battery that had a range of at least 100 miles and could be made to be easily inter-changeable, then if Mitsubishi joined forces with a petrol supplier e.g. Shell then they could offer a battery lease option were you could turn up at a Shell forecourt and change your depleted battery for a freshly charged one, and if they really got their heads around it they could have an industry standard battery that could be fitted across manufacturers. This would also alleviate any worries about battery degredation over time as the leased batteries could have a minimum serviceable capacity of 85-90%
I know that is a lot of what-ifs and pie in the sky and I will add it to my list of things I would like along with hover-boots and world peace.
ChrisMiller
Well-known member
Battery swapping has often been proposed as a solution to the problem of EV recharging taking 20-30 mins (or more). But, apart from the practical difficulties Sumpy has identified, there are at least two further issues.
1. For a pure EV the battery forms a significant part of the value of the vehicle, and as we all know they deteriorate (slowly) with age and use. Imagine you've just paid £50k for a shiny new electric BMW - how happy are you going to be, the first time you 're low on juice, for the battery to be swapped for one from a 10-year-old Dacia?
2. We've swapped the battery - great, now what do we do with it? If it's recharged at the 'filling station', each filling station is going to need a multi-megawatt power supply to cope with typical daily usage (this is just highlighting the fact that most countries' electrical grids couldn't handle the extra demand from EVs forming a large part of the national transport fleet). Alternatively, the batteries need to be swapped with some central recharging station built adjacent to a power plant, which is going to need a massive amount of heavy goods mileage hauling batteries around the place.
I'm sure there are other issues I haven't thought of.
1. For a pure EV the battery forms a significant part of the value of the vehicle, and as we all know they deteriorate (slowly) with age and use. Imagine you've just paid £50k for a shiny new electric BMW - how happy are you going to be, the first time you 're low on juice, for the battery to be swapped for one from a 10-year-old Dacia?
2. We've swapped the battery - great, now what do we do with it? If it's recharged at the 'filling station', each filling station is going to need a multi-megawatt power supply to cope with typical daily usage (this is just highlighting the fact that most countries' electrical grids couldn't handle the extra demand from EVs forming a large part of the national transport fleet). Alternatively, the batteries need to be swapped with some central recharging station built adjacent to a power plant, which is going to need a massive amount of heavy goods mileage hauling batteries around the place.
I'm sure there are other issues I haven't thought of.
anko
Well-known member
You don't buy the battery, you lease / rent it. Zoe's can be bought incl. or excl. battery.ChrisMiller said:
Total mount of energy needed is not affected (unless you see the success of the setup as part of its own problem ;-) ). Recharge task is spread out over 24 hours per day instead of being cramped in a series of '30 minutes or less' windows. So, amount of power needed would potentially be less.ChrisMiller said:
Not saying / see it happening. That is something else :mrgreen:
BTW: In the new Ampera e, the battery housing is part of the body structure / stiffness. Don't see that being replaced at a petrol station.
Regulo
Well-known member
Diverging a little - I've just read that a company developing technology to make diesel and petrol engines more efficient (Torotrak) has suspended development of it's technology, blaming the shift towards electric power in the motor industry. Are we reaching a tipping point within the next decade where electric vehicles will become mainstream? There must come a time when either battery technology has to make a quantum leap, or some form of mass, interchangeable battery pack becomes the norm. I can't see any other way forward.
ChrisMiller
Well-known member
anko said:
True, but I'm still not swapping my brand new battery for one that's 10 years old with 150,000 km on the clock. Because I'd quite like to get home tonight.
anko
Well-known member
Well, it wouldn't be your battery then. I mean, maybe your brand new BMW was delivered to you with a 10 year old battery with 150k miles on it. Who would know? :mrgreen: And if, as Sumpy suggests, battery condition is warranted, what would be the issue?ChrisMiller said:
A further problem that would prevent this is the initial cost of setting up the network, it would be too expensive and if battery technology keeps advancing as fast as it is (Tesla X has a 100kwh battery and a claimed 351 mile range) then within a few years and before the battery replacement scheme started making any profit, battery capacity and price will be the more affordable option. I only hope that Mitsubishi will see fit to have a scheme of upgrading the PHEV's that we already have with the higher capacity batteries as they become affordable, but if we could have a range of 350 plus miles then will we really need the ICE?
Regulo
Well-known member
No, but if everybody had an EV, to paraphrase the famous Jaws quote, "You're gonna need a bigger power station". MUCH bigger!!Sumpy said:
jaapv
Well-known member
Well, if your destination is more than 350 miles off an ICE should come in handy... :twisted:Sumpy said:
ChrisMiller
Well-known member
If you imagine taking out the ICE and filling the front of the PHEV with more batteries*, you might be able to get close to 90 or even 100kWh. Then what? It would take most of us two days to recharge from 'empty', so you'd need a high-speed charger at home, which (at least, for many UK customers) would require rewiring the house and possibly a new electric feed.Sumpy said:
An acquaintance has lusted after a Tesla S for years, but the nearest 'supercharger' is 30 minutes drive away, so it's completely impractical for him.
* I doubt this would improve the handling
