Love the car - but 30 miles on EV?

[baldrick]

Had been following the Outlander PHEV forum for a while after ordering one as a company lease car. I took delivery around three weeks back and am generally pleased with the car. However, I would like to make anyone considering ordering aware of a few points.

I have a commute of 25 miles to work so anticipated being able to get there, charge up during the day and drive home again all on EV power without having to use any petrol until the weekend. Happy days, should save me about £50 a week on fuel after driving my Kia Sportage for the last three years.

However, I have the Gx3h model and being the base model does not have an electric heater. The result of this is that to run any heat in the car the petrol engine needs to start. I thought this odd a first but didn't think this would be such a big deal (after all it was only using a bit of petrol surely)

Now despite having driven as economically as possible whilst getting use to the various readings and options, I have had to fill up three times (£45 each time) and only on a few occasions have I had call to use the petrol engine to actually drive the wheels.

I decided to test how far I could get on pure EV by not putting the heater one one morning (as ridiculous as that might seem) and only managed 22 miles on a full charge (but without the engine kicking in and boosting the EV range in series mode)

Now, don't get me wrong, I really do like the car and I think over time I will come to terms with the fact that this is a great 4x4 with a pretty good mpg overall. The BIK for company car driver is also a massive incentive (not sure how much this equates to in my pay packet yet)

I just think its important that people know that its unlikely you will drive this particular model as a pure EV over the advertised 30 miles range. Would it not of made sense to put an electric heater in all models?

 

[maby]

Putting an electric heater in does not really increase the EV range - rather the opposite really. What it does do is to reduce the tendency to burn petrol to heat the car on short trips when you have a full battery. We have a GX4 with the electric heater and I reckon we're doing ok to get 20 miles on battery on a cold day.

 

[Regulo]

Putting an electric heater in does not really increase the EV range - rather the opposite really. What it does do is to reduce the tendency to burn petrol to heat the car on short trips when you have a full battery. We have a GX4 with the electric heater and I reckon we're doing ok to get 20 miles on battery on a cold day.

I'd agree with both of you. Mitsubishi are guilty of the mis-information of all car manufacturers, in as much as you can't believe a word of what you're told. We all know that in the real world you'll be highly unlikely to reproduce the quoted MPG (or EV range) of ANY manufacturer. Until they're forced to tell us real-world figures, obtained by ordinary drivers, they'll carry on with the dark arts. I saw 25 miles on EV (GX4H) in September, but I'm lucky to get 20 now. Unless I want to drive around like Nanook of the Frozen North. Which I don't!

 

[aitchjaybee]

i got an actual (and exceptional/unusual) 28 miles on my full charge today, and had headlights and wipers on, with a bit of seat heating too. Roads were much quieter and with the rain the overall speed was down which helps economy. Mostly been 19-23 range in the cold with heating etc. (and more road resistance on tyres, denser colder air)

In the summer, achieving an actual 30+ is not very difficult at all in the semi rural area where I am, and from comments on the forum I think many others are able to get that too.

Part of the problem is us (as general population, include myself here) seeing "32 mile range" and being gutted when it doesnt achieve that. There's a Honda CR-V ad at the moment saying it will do 62.7mpg but I bet you not many of us would get more than 50mpg out of it in real world. Its broadly the same issue.
I think it is fair to comment on the lack of electric heater in the base model, it does mean it has to revert to petrol for heat, and without the ability to pre-heat the car, you can't even set off warm, and the lack of seat heaters means there's no other option. At least the petrol engine heats up quicker than a diesel, and in the UK unleaded is 5% cheaper than diesel too.

 

[greendwarf]

and without the ability to pre-heat the car, you can't even set off warm, and the lack of seat heaters means there's no other option.

Do you mean like in an ordinary ICE car?

 

[ufo]

I mentioned this in an another tread but will mention it again here cause it is related. In Sydney's relatively warm climate (5 to 45 Degrees C) I always get declared 52 km (32 miles) or more. Only thing reducing this figure is A/C during cooling. I have electric heating when I turn on heating I make sure I turn A/C off and there is almost no loss of range. I try to avoid using friction brakes as much as possible and slow down only with regenerative braking and getting really good at it. Sometimes I can get to work and go back home (24km) without touching brakes. Being in ECO or NORMAL does not make any difference if you are easy on the accelerator.

 

[baldrick]

That's why I love this forum. Everyone willing to chip in with their own experiences. You can learn so much, so quickly.

Having had my moan about the electric heater, if the average mpg gauge is anything to go by I seem to be getting anything between 70-90mpg on my normal 25 mile commute depending on how I drive and the traffic. I have even got to the point where it reached 99mpg on one run but then decided it couldn't go higher and blanked out (curious as to why this should be?)

I agree that we should all take manufacturers claims with a pinch of salt but I am sure I am not alone in being wooed but Mitsubishi's headline claims of 30mpg on a full charge (not to mention 148mpg combined)

As most people seem to have concluded. Don't believe all the hype but enjoy the drive anyway.

 

[jaapv]

Putting an electric heater in does not really increase the EV range - rather the opposite really. What it does do is to reduce the tendency to burn petrol to heat the car on short trips when you have a full battery. We have a GX4 with the electric heater and I reckon we're doing ok to get 20 miles on battery on a cold day.

I'd agree with both of you. Mitsubishi are guilty of the mis-information of all car manufacturers, in as much as you can't believe a word of what you're told. We all know that in the real world you'll be highly unlikely to reproduce the quoted MPG (or EV range) of ANY manufacturer. Until they're forced to tell us real-world figures, obtained by ordinary drivers, they'll carry on with the dark arts. I saw 25 miles on EV (GX4H) in September, but I'm lucky to get 20 now. Unless I want to drive around like Nanook of the Frozen North. Which I don’t!

Actually they are forced by law to give you the current figures. Rather blame the law makers than the manufacturers.

 

[Regulo]

Actually they are forced by law to give you the current figures. Rather blame the law makers than the manufacturers.

There was an interesting article a few weeks ago in the paper, telling how the "official" figures can be obtained, and some of the tricks used. The test criteria are laid down, but the manufacturers can interpret them in any way they like. For instance the test criteria states "an incline of no more than 3%" - but it doesn't state which way! Guess what the manufacturer uses? And a temperature of between 20 and 30C. As engines are more efficient at higher temperatures, they test them at 29.5C. All seams are taped over, tyres over-inflated etc., etc. All little tricks within the letter of the test, but not indicative of your experience on the road. BTW, not sure of the detail of all the above, but that was the gist of it. Oh, for some common sense by our Ministries!

 

[gwatpe]

Here in Australia the EV range is quoted at 52km.

I to had thought this was a myth as well, only to be achieved in strictly controlled test conditions.

My PHEV, the Aspire model, Actic Silver, with all the factory std options was recently replaced. I am on number 3 now. The first PHEV had reduced, best EV range of 43km for a flat, minimum turns, rural test circuit, and regen was only effective in the lower half of the battery capacity. Mitsubishi generously supplied me with a loan PHEV, the same model but in grey, to compare with. This vehicle could manage 45km without much trouble and the regen was effective up to about 80% full battery. Had none of the computer problems, but still had a LHS HID issue. Mitsubishi investigated the battery of my original PHEV and decided to replace my original PHEV.

Many months later, I finally have a replacement PHEV. Not NEW, but close enough.

Have not had time to test drive on the flat circuit, but on another EV test drive circuit with steep hills and B roads as well as town driving, the replacement managed 51.6km on the full battery. The battery took 11.6kWh to refill. This replacement PHEV has very effective regen, even when almost fully charged. This is what I expected from my new car almost 6 months ago, but it never seemed to be right. This replacement PHEV just shows the huge variability in performance that appears to result with apparently small differences in the battery. BTW the ambient temp was 21C, so even though AirCon was on, probably not much energy needed to keep cabin temp at 23C, only fresh air and the fans.

I would be investigating the battery, having ruled out any other factors, if the PHEV was not giving expected EV range. It seems like all PHEV are not made equally well.

 

[Ozukus]

When purchasing a vehicle like this you have to take into consideration your own circumstances. Mine by example is as follows.

I have an office commute of 94 miles which includes a cross London journey of 34 miles and a return motorway journey of 60 miles.

So for a comparison if I want a reasonable size SUV within the £30K limit then I have a number of options, so if I take current fuel rates of £1.22 for petrol, £1.27 for diesel and £0.11 per KW then add in the cost of the VED and work on the basis I will do 12K per annum then my commute cost in these vehicles would be as follows.

£17.46 Kia Sportage
£17.39 Ford Kuga
£16.29 Hyundai Sante Fe
£16.05 Toyota Rav 4
£12.86 Mazda CX5
£11.90 Nissan Xtrail
£10.46 Outlander PHEV GX3h

The above is based off official mpg - 10% (still optimistic) for all other vehicles and the 57mpg that I actually achieved on my commute in the PHEV. This alone puts it in front yet doesn't take into consideration the following.

Next year my company will install charge points at work so my cost will reduce.
On my cross London commute if I do get stuck in traffic and don't get out of the congestion zone before 7am it's no charge on the PHEV, £14 on the others. Either that or I add another 26 miles to the round trip doing both by motorway for the other vehicles.
It's currently winter so not optimal performance for a PHEV or EV of any kind.
All my local driving will be primarily EV or reasonable EV percentage of drive.

No I'm not getting 148mpg or guaranteed 32 miles EV range, however it's still cost effective and if I was a company car driver the £2,600-£3,000 per annum I would save would make it an absolutely no brainer

 

[Paule23]

I drive to the train station just over a mile away, not sure I'm going to get full use out of they potential of this car..... :mrgreen:

 

[maby]

I drive to the train station just over a mile away, not sure I'm going to get full use out of they potential of this car..... :mrgreen:

Your results will be totally dependent on what you do with it over the weekend. We are in a similar position to you - we do between 5 and 10 miles per day during the week and between 150 and 200 miles each weekend - with no opportunity to charge - our MPG over the last three months is averaging just over 50. There's electricity to add to that too - I haven't bothered to do the overall sum for a few weeks, but I guess I'm getting an effective MPG of around 48. It is very seasonal - I calculated over 50mpge in October which was quite warm.

 

[Ozukus]

Interestingly enough got in the car today was showing 37 mile EV range

 

[ufo]

Just for the record, I got 56.6 kms pure EV drive in Sydney's congested urban traffic today. PHEV was in normal mode, no A/C, used regen as much as possible. This is my record since I've started checking it about a month ago.

 

[gwatpe]

I would expect to get higher range traveled at the slower speeds. I was recently in Sydney with the old PHEV and was stuck in traffic for hours and was very thankful the EV did all the work, keeping the car and me cool.

 

[Rogerp]

I have widely variable ranges on EV depending on the temperature outside, driving style and when I loaded the 3 kids, wife and dog in to the car

 

[NeilP]

Pottering round town, kids run, traffic (don't care as long as acceleration isn't brisk) and my 28miles EV seems ok in this cold with lights etc on.

Tend to set B5 which I'm used to when the battery is empty, ie max regenerative braking at roundabouts, junctions etc, but when the batteries are above something like 80% b5 isn't very effective and you have to use the brakes

A little alarming till you get used to this... Or just drive with B3 as most others

 

[ufo]

I would expect to get higher range traveled at the slower speeds. I was recently in Sydney with the old PHEV and was stuck in traffic for hours and was very thankful the EV did all the work, keeping the car and me cool.

Sorry but going to disagree on this with you. It wouldn't make any difference if you are traveling slow or fast, you should get the same range as long as you are carefull with the accelerator. Doesn't matter what type of vehicle it is, ICE, PHEV or standard hybrid, heavy urban traffic (repeated stop & go) would produce worst range (mileage), beacuse it takes muach more energy/fuel to get going compared to going at a steady speed.

 

[maby]

I would expect to get higher range traveled at the slower speeds. I was recently in Sydney with the old PHEV and was stuck in traffic for hours and was very thankful the EV did all the work, keeping the car and me cool.

Sorry but going to disagree on this with you. It wouldn't make any difference if you are traveling slow or fast, you should get the same range as long as you are carefull with the accelerator. Doesn't matter what type of vehicle it is, ICE, PHEV or standard hybrid, heavy urban traffic (repeated stop & go) would produce worst range (mileage), beacuse it takes muach more energy/fuel to get going compared to going at a steady speed.

No, no, no! Drag increases rapidly with speed (with the square of speed, if my memory serves me right) - it takes a lot more energy to keep a car moving at 100mph than it does to keep the same car moving at 60mph.

See Wikipedia:

"Of particular importance is the v^2 dependence on velocity, meaning that fluid drag increases with the square of velocity. When velocity is doubled, for example, not only does the fluid strike with twice the velocity, but twice the mass of fluid strikes per second. Therefore the change of momentum per second is multiplied by four. Force is equivalent to the change of momentum divided by time. This is in contrast with solid-on-solid friction, which generally has very little velocity dependence."