Economy

[Claymore]

35 miles round trip yesterday, car charged but only 23 miles predicted.

116 mpg overall for the trip.

Mustn't grumble.

JimB

 

[RDClark66]

When talking economy of a PHEV shouldn't we be comparing costs in pence per mile as how can you compare miles driven in EV mode to those using petrol ?

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

My previous vehicle was a VW Touran 2.0 Bluemotion which for my journeys averaged around 45 mpg overall ( short commute to work plus long business trips ),
or at current pump prices about 11.11pence per mile

I have recorded my fuel spend and charges to date and approximate my cost to be 11.52 over 3359 miles since taking delivery of the car.

So not bad if you multiply up the 0.41p difference by 16000 miles per year = £65.60 extra in running costs.

BUT.. the main reason for me to opt for a PHEV is it is a company car so I have recovered at least £60 per month in my pocket due to the 42g CO2 figure.

The jury is still out as to whether I am delighted with the car as it lacks quite a few features of my previous but some of that is down to model choice ( dictated by lease cost ).
But it is a dream to drive and I love zipping around in EV mode almost silently !

 

[geoffshep69]

When talking economy of a PHEV shouldn't we be comparing costs in pence per mile as how can you compare miles driven in EV mode to those using petrol ?

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

My last fill up covered just short of 1000 miles, and my petrol mpg for that period was 151 mpg. Factoring in the cost of electricity, and assuming that I had spent that on petrol instead, my adjusted mpg was c. 70mpg. The overall cost per mile worked out at around 6.5p.

As a company car driver, I was also attracted by the low BIK tax, and my overall monthly lease cost (inclusive of tax) is c. £100 per month less than had I taken an equivalent SUV such as a Qashqai, Mazda CX-5, etc. My previous car was a Qashqai diesel, and I used to average about 46mpg overall. On the basis that I’m already £100 per month better off due to the leasing and tax costs, I’d be happy if I did no better than to match what I was getting in the Qashqai. The fact that I am getting 70 mpg (after allowing for electricity costs) as opposed to 46 mpg in the Qashqai is an added bonus.

My usage pattern fits the car really nicely. I have a 13 mile each way commute to work, and pretty much all of that is done on pure EV. I make the occasional longer trip but the lower mpg I get on those trips (in comparison to a diesel) is more than outweighed by the significantly better economy I get the rest of the time.

The car is not perfect, but to my mind it’s a decent size, it runs smoothly and quietly, has all the performance I need and is also an automatic (albeit not in the traditional sense) and a 4WD. I have absolutely no complaints at all about choosing it.

 

[SolarBoy]

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

Not in all cases does it cost to charge at home, I get paid by the government via the UK's solar panel subsidy to recharge my Outlander

 

[anko]

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

Not in all cases does it cost to charge at home, I get paid by the government via the UK's solar panel subsidy to recharge my Outlander

Would you not have received this subsidy if it wasn't for the PHEV? And could you not have used the power from the panels for other purposes, for which you must now buy power? To be honest, I don't think there is such thing as free power.

 

[SolarBoy]

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

Not in all cases does it cost to charge at home, I get paid by the government via the UK's solar panel subsidy to recharge my Outlander

Would you not have received this subsidy if it wasn't for the PHEV? And could you not have used the power from the panels for other purposes, for which you must now buy power? To be honest, I don't think there is such thing as free power.

Yes I would have received the subsidy even if I hadn't have used the power locally sorry it was a poor attempt at being funny.

I can charge at the full 16Amps if it's April and the sun is out, and have enough power left over to run my house and my home office.

The dishwasher/washing machine and tumble dryer are switched on either before or after charging the car, otherwise indeed I have to purchase power. I will be adding more panels and battery storage in the next 1 to 2 years.

 

[greendwarf]

Charging at home still costs money so it needs to be part of the equation.

Not in all cases does it cost to charge at home, I get paid by the government via the UK's solar panel subsidy to recharge my Outlander

Would you not have received this subsidy if it wasn't for the PHEV? And could you not have used the power from the panels for other purposes, for which you must now buy power? To be honest, I don't think there is such thing as free power.

I assume that SolarBoy also gets paid for each unit he produces and doesn't use himself, so charging the car "costs" him this, as well.

 

[anko]

Yes I would have received the subsidy even if I hadn't have used the power locally sorry it was a poor attempt at being funny.

Cool, no problem . Your remark triggered a memory of a lengthy discussion I had with a Dutch guy who on one side claimed that charging his car was virtually free and on the other site calculated ROI on his panels using commercial electricity rates. This discussion made me a bit allergic to statements about cheap charging via panels

 

[SolarBoy]

I assume that SolarBoy also gets paid for each unit he produces and doesn't use himself, so charging the car "costs" him this, as well.

Hi greendwarf, I assumed this as well prior to getting panels, but it's incorrect.

Here are the ins and outs:

- When generating electricity I don't need to buy electricity from the grid, so I save money.
- I get paid for every kW/h generated, this called the Generation Tariff
- I also get paid an additional fee for every kW/h called deemed export assumed to be 50% of the energy I generated.

I don't have an 'export meter', therefore is I get paid the same amount whether or not I export 0% of what I generate or whether I export 100% of the energy I generate. Crazy eh?

This is my first payment:

 

[anko]

You mean these reading come straight from your solar panel installation and not from your normal meter? And you get payed for power that you generate and use yourself? That is crazy, indeed.

But yet, any kW (self generated or not) that goes into your car cannot go into your washing machine and needs to be replaced by another one.

 

[jaapv]

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

 

[anko]

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

Only if you have overcapacity for which you don't get any compensation, then it is sort of 'free' to use that overcapacity for charging the car. But in that case, you are effectively using the car to fix a very poor decision you have made in the past ...

 

[SolarBoy]

You mean these reading come straight from your solar panel installation and not from your normal meter? And you get payed for power that you generate and use yourself? That is cray, indeed.

But yet, any kW (self generated or not) that goes into your car cannot go into your washing machine and needs to be replaced by another one.

Yes crazy!

There is a 'generation' meter which records the total energy generated. The figures for the payments come from this meter.

I have a separate monitor with a remote display which shows energy being generated and energy being used by the house. Therefore we know if we are importing or exporting electricity, and we can schedule the running of the other appliances to minimise buying electricity.

Any excess that isn't being used for charging or on appliances heats our hot water tank and this saves money on our natural gas bill.

Of course this all depends on the sun coming out :lol:

Very happy to answer any other questions you or others may have.

 

[SolarBoy]

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

Only if you have overcapacity for which you don't get any compensation, then it is sort of 'free' to use that overcapacity for charging the car. But in that case, you are effectively using the car to fix a very poor decision you have made in the past ...

I have a house extension planned, on the new roof I want to add another 6kW of panels and home battery storage so we are grid independent at night. I plan to stay in this house for the next 30 years (assuming I live that long :lol: ) so it makes financial sense.

 

[anko]

Any excess that isn't being used for charging or on appliances heats our hot water tank and this saves money on our natural gas bill.

So, the less you charge, the more you save on your natural gas bill .... Or, the more you charge, the less you save on your natural gas bill?

 

[greendwarf]

I assume that SolarBoy also gets paid for each unit he produces and doesn't use himself, so charging the car "costs" him this, as well.

Hi greendwarf, I assumed this as well prior to getting panels, but it's incorrect.

Here are the ins and outs:

- When generating electricity I don't need to buy electricity from the grid, so I save money.
- I get paid for every kW/h generated, this called the Generation Tariff
- I also get paid an additional fee for every kW/h called deemed export assumed to be 50% of the energy I generated.

I don't have an 'export meter', therefore is I get paid the same amount whether or not I export 0% of what I generate or whether I export 100% of the energy I generate. Crazy eh?

Thanks, now you mention it, yes I remember - which also means that you get paid for exporting energy even if you don't! So there is no incentive to improve further your energy efficiency once the tariff has been set. In fact the reverse is true

 

[jaapv]

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

Only if you have overcapacity for which you don't get any compensation, then it is sort of 'free' to use that overcapacity for charging the car. But in that case, you are effectively using the car to fix a very poor decision you have made in the past ...

Why shouldn't you get any compensation?

http://www.wijwillenzon.nl/faq/4/financia%C2%ABle-vragen/73/teruglevering-en-saldering-uitleg-regelgeving.html

 

[anko]

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

Only if you have overcapacity for which you don't get any compensation, then it is sort of 'free' to use that overcapacity for charging the car. But in that case, you are effectively using the car to fix a very poor decision you have made in the past ...

Why shouldn't you get any compensation?

http://www.wijwillenzon.nl/faq/4/financia%C2%ABle-vragen/73/teruglevering-en-saldering-uitleg-regelgeving.html

For sure. But now you got me all confused. Please explain, what did you mean when you wrote:

If you have a large enough solar system, it works the same way over here, Anko. Or enough shares in Meewind.

 

[Pberger]

Many thanks for the responses, really appreciated, I have averaged around 43/44 this week (roughly based on amount of fuel and just looking at the fuel gauge)

 

[Kesto]

Hi I have two trips to Birmingham from Leeds 107 miles each way. Best option is start with full charge + ECO , as soon as you hit motorway change to add SAVE + Cruise control +B3. The car then does it by itself. ICE will come on for few minutes then pure EV for for few minutes. ICE is never on all the time . You will get around 55 mpg if set at 57 _ 60mph. Worst is 42 mpg is you are constantly do 65+. The is good for a petrol car this size. Most deisel 4×4 will not give more than this what ever they say.