Australians down under

I have spent days reading lots of the posts in this forum trying to help me make a decision about a car purchase. I live in Sydney and currently own a 2014 Subaru Forester. This car has done 40K and like most Subarus it has been faultless. I get around 6.6 to 7.0 l/100km on the open road while city driving varies between 8.0 and 10.0. It is very good on dirt roads, I don’t 4WD but like to go into state forests,etc, on standard dirt tracks, about half my driving is in the country.
However, I very much like the PHEV Outlander particularly the EV mode for city driving. Currently, there are no new models on the market (Mitsubishi say the new model is coming in March) and in Sydney I cannot even find a 2nd hand one although there seems to be plenty for sale in Adelaide, Brisbane and Perth. They are asking around $30K for 2014 models with 15-20K km. Consequently I have yet to drive one.
I have 3kW of solar panels on the roof and so city driving would be virtually cost free.
My questions to current owners of the vehicle are:
What fuel consumption should I expect on the open road (ie without battery assistance)? The answers in the forum seem to be all over the place – Trex testing his at 7.2 while others report 10.0.
After a couple of years of ownership are you still happy with the vehicle (there does seem to be a lot of complaints about minor issues)?
A question which is probably impossible to answer, but do you think I would be disappointed if I replaced the Forester with an Outlander PHEV?
Thanks in advance for your responses.

Hi solgen,

I can only answer the fuel consumption question. With the original tires and an empty battery at start I can make around 9L/100km at highway speeds (120km/h), 8L/100km if I keep it closer to 60km/h. I have sometimes hit lower than this, but in very particular circumstances (probably destination is lower in height than source). On the other hand, with battery charges I have run it for 2 weeks at 0L/100km (aircon/heater turned off). My experience is that it will do around 40km on battery during the winter, but should probably improve once I get to summer temperatures.

I have recently "upgraded" (depends on who you ask, my wife does not agree the tires to BFGoodrich AT, and besides being a bit noisier (since you don't hear the engine, you do notice the tires) they also increased consumption slightly (perhaps by 0.5L/100km). Of course you have tires that improve the consumptions since the original Toyo R37's are not particularly good at fuel efficiency (graded "E" at least in europe).

I've owned mine for only 3 months so I cannot answer the "after years of ownership" question. But yes, so far I would buy it again. For the price, it lacks some of the polishing, e.g., a volkswagen (my opinion, this was my former car) will give you, but I like the fact that I can look under the chassis and see everything (the volkswagen would cover everything in plastic so it would always be a black box you'd be afraid to touch). Still, they could improve a bit in this area as to reprogram my TPMS sensors in the new tyres it seems I have to go to the dealer (scheduled for today). Some brands have a user procedure that can be run.

Regarding the Forester, I truly cannot answer

Hope it helps.

Ricardo

solgen said:

I have spent days reading lots of the posts in this forum trying to help me make a decision about a car purchase. I live in Sydney and currently own a 2014 Subaru Forester. This car has done 40K and like most Subarus it has been faultless. I get around 6.6 to 7.0 l/100km on the open road while city driving varies between 8.0 and 10.0. It is very good on dirt roads, I don’t 4WD but like to go into state forests,etc, on standard dirt tracks, about half my driving is in the country.
However, I very much like the PHEV Outlander particularly the EV mode for city driving. Currently, there are no new models on the market (Mitsubishi say the new model is coming in March) and in Sydney I cannot even find a 2nd hand one although there seems to be plenty for sale in Adelaide, Brisbane and Perth. They are asking around $30K for 2014 models with 15-20K km. Consequently I have yet to drive one.
I have 3kW of solar panels on the roof and so city driving would be virtually cost free.
My questions to current owners of the vehicle are:
What fuel consumption should I expect on the open road (ie without battery assistance)? The answers in the forum seem to be all over the place – Trex testing his at 7.2 while others report 10.0.
After a couple of years of ownership are you still happy with the vehicle (there does seem to be a lot of complaints about minor issues)?
A question which is probably impossible to answer, but do you think I would be disappointed if I replaced the Forester with an Outlander PHEV?
Thanks in advance for your responses.

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Well, had mine for 15 months now. I live in Sydney and I bought a used one with 10,000km on it.
Very happy with the car, it does what I bought it for as I do mainly very short trips, so I rarely put fuel in it.
I have a 1.5kW solar system and it generates almost exactly what my car uses in a day (when the sun shines .
Highway fuel consumption is around 8/100 if you drive within our speed limits.
Last week I did a trip from Sydney to Nowra and back, which was a horrible drive, lots of fog and rain, so fairly slow driving. It used exactly 7/100 on that trip. I have used as little as 6/100 in city driving with the battery empty as it works quite well as a hybrid.
I noticed too that most of the used ones at Sydney dealers have gone.

solgen said:

do you think I would be disappointed if I replaced the Forester with an Outlander PHEV?

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I owned a Forester back in 2002 and found it was quite poor with front tyres, maybe that has improved? I've also owned a Honda CRV and have had the Outlander PHEV for almost 2 years. I love it, it is slightly bigger than the CRV and 2002 Forester, not sure compared to yours?

Most of the other questions have been answered, certainly the Aspire is a luxurious vehicle. Flying interstate to view a PHEV won't cost you much, and most dealers will assist with relocating and changing rego (eg I was in discussions with a dealer on Gold Coast who was happy to transfer a PHEV to NSW rego).

Just remember that you can only utilise your solar to charge your PHEV on clear sunny days when you are at home during the day. Depending on your requirements, those factors may not overlap as often as you think. I charge using the PHEV's timer to get the off-peak TOU tariff of 9c/kWh, and export my PV @ 6c/kWh. To me, its not worth chasing that 3c/kWh difference, because when you get it wrong and draw from the grid in daytime, the penalty at say 26c/kWh is 17c/kWh. Its much easier to charge at night and run appliances in the day when you need them IMHO.

Thanks very much for your responses.
I notice that there are a lot for sale in Adelaide, perhaps as Mitsubishi had their headquarters they had lots of company cars and are now getting rid of them.
Almost decided, but my other major concern is lack of a spare tyre. It might be OK in Europe to have goo to fix a flat tyre but in Australia with our big distances it may be an issue. Admittedly, flat tyres are uncommon these days but I did get a piece of steel in one of the tyres on the Forester recently and was certainly happy that I had a full size spare.

Hi Solgen,

The spare tire was the main reason I bought the BFGoodrich K02 (see other recent post). It helps, but is a bit expensive and not 100% secure...

Best,
Ricardo

solgen said:

Almost decided, but my other major concern is lack of a spare tyre. It might be OK in Europe to have goo to fix a flat tyre but in Australia with our big distances it may be an issue. Admittedly, flat tyres are uncommon these days but I did get a piece of steel in one of the tyres on the Forester recently and was certainly happy that I had a full size spare.

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I don't know why but I have just picked up my 4th slow puncture caused by a nail/screw in the tread here in "rugged" Sarf Lundun in just over 2.5 years - compared with fewer than that over the previous 50 years of driving! Perhaps it's bigger tyres and a heavier car but I am nervous about not having a spare when I go on a long journey.

Hiya,

I'm one of the Adelaide owners and can confirm that a lot of the second hand PHEVs are ex lease from Mitsubishi employees.

Mitsubishi were moving them on after 12 months on lease.

(Mine was one).

I've had mine for nearly two years, and haven't had any problems with it at all.

Because of the lack of a spare, I've fitted tyre pressure sensors (the dust cap kind) and have so far only had to repair one nail hole.

The TPMS picked up the fault far earlier than I could, and it was a cheap repair.

My current plan is to replace those sensors, with the kind that fits inside the tyre, when I replace the current tyres. (Still original factory tyres).

I deliberately use some petrol to keep the engine in good nick, but 99% of my driving is EV only.



Andy

Thanks zzcoopej for your information re charging

Just remember that you can only utilise your Solar to charge your PHEV on clear sunny days when you are at home during the day. Depending on your requirements, those factors may not overlap as often as you think. I charge using the PHEV's timer to get the off-peak TOU tariff of 9c/kWh, and export my PV @ 6c/kWh. To me, its not worth chasing that 3c/kWh difference, because when you get it wrong and draw from the grid in daytime, the penalty at say 26c/kWh is 17c/kWh. Its much easier to charge at night and run appliances in the day when you need them IMHO.

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You make a very good point, our average daily generation is around 9kWh and in simple terms this is adequate for charging a PHEV. However, as the solar generation follows a curve the will many times during the day that there is not 2.4kW available to charge and so the electricity would come through the meter at high cost. Consequently, I like your strategy of using off-peak power for charging at a cost of 24c (3*8) per charge, this will hardly break the bank!
I might be making a trip to Adelaide shortly.

Let me guess Agostino Mitsubishi?

solgen said:

my other major concern is lack of a spare tyre. It might be OK in Europe to have goo to fix a flat tyre but in Australia with our big distances it may be an issue. Admittedly, flat tyres are uncommon these days but I did get a piece of steel in one of the tyres on the Forester recently and was certainly happy that I had a full size spare.

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I actually had a nail stuck in a rear tyre the very first week... it was a slow leak and it gave me a chance to test the included compressor, which actually works well and I managed to just drive to the local tyre place and have it fixed.
Now I carry a set of plugs, I have used them a few times on other cars and they always work if you can find what the bit stuck in the tyre and it is not in the sidewall.
And to be doubly sure, I bought a wheel and tyre.... not the original but same size. It cost me about $300.00, I carry that in the boot when I feel the need......

Looks like the MY2017 will happen here in Australia before too long.. you can register your interest at the MMA website already.....

ultralights said:

Patsparks said:

I'm a new owner of a used PHEV Aspire with 37,000 on it purchased just before Christmas. I've been driving on petrol while waiting for the charger to be installed on J tariff (SA off peak separately metered power) which is around half the price of standard tariff electric.

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are you still charging using the EVSE? ,
the charger that came with the car that plugs into a normal power point?

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Yes I am but the electrician cut the plug off and hard wired the charger into a dedicated circuit via an isolator switch.

Patsparks said:

the electrician cut the plug off and hard wired the charger into a dedicated circuit via an isolator switch.

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I was looking at getting the same thing done. Could I ask how much that cost you?

NilbogAus said:

Patsparks said:

the electrician cut the plug off and hard wired the charger into a dedicated circuit via an isolator switch.

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I was looking at getting the same thing done. Could I ask how much that cost you?

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My cost was quite high because I had to have the power run from one side of the house to the other and I have vaulted ceilings so it was hard work. I paid $600 and also had another power point put in. Most of the cost was in cable and installing same in conduit right around the house. About a 30 metre run.

solgen said:

Thanks very much for your responses.
I notice that there are a lot for sale in Adelaide, perhaps as Mitsubishi had their headquarters they had lots of company cars and are now getting rid of them.

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I bought the last available not new Outlander PHEV Aspire in Adelaide on December23, 2016 which was a used one. If you don't want an Aspire then head to Adelaide. There may be more in stock now.
It was a little frustrating being told they had no stock when some dealers had stock a week earlier. Bought mine as a used car not an ex Mitsi car, really wanted the Aspire for the adaptive cruise.

Patsparks said:

really wanted the Aspire for the adaptive cruise.

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ACC's awesome isn't it, the PHEV really shines in its ability to smoothly accelerate and especially decelerate due to the instant regen. I used ACC extensively on a 100km trip yesterday on unfamiliar roads which had signposted speeds varying from 50 to 100km/h. ACC made driving so much more relaxing, and after starting with a flat battery (had been away and this was the return trip) managed 6.3 l/100km.

I've been using CHARGE instead of SAVE recently and I'm really sold now. It requires a bit more thinking, however basically you push CHARGE when you know you'll be doing over 70km/h for a while ie parallel hybrid (direct drive). Then switch CHARGE off and use up the battery in the under 70km/h sections and it does bring your fuel consumption down by about 0.5 l/100km. Why? Because the engine is more efficient when its direct driving the wheels at higher speeds, than when it is generating electricity to drive the electric motor. This result has been reproduced around the world by quite a few people now.

Hi All
Ive just bought a 2 year old Aspire and driven it to Hobart where I live. First question, the charge plug appears to be a 10 amp not 15amp with big earth pin. So is that a common mod? I havent plugged in yet till I know a but more but battery is charged from my drive!

The charger that comes with the car is 10A. You need a dedicated charger to get 16A in.
Welcome to the Forum and many happy miles!

Hoppy,

I've heard of Australian owners replacing the plug on their chargers with 10 amp plugs, because the unit never draws 15 amps.

It may have been here, or on whirlpool forums that I came across the chat.

Saves you having to install a 15 amp socket (like I did) in your driveway.

Welcome aboard!